Classical No 13

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Mon Jan 27, 2014 9:21 pm

Its been a quiet time in the workshop over the last year or so mainly due to a heavy workload but also due to the earthquakes in Christchurch New Zealand and the aftermath of same. Anyway over the last few weeks I finally found time to start a new build...a falcate braced classical with bolt on/bolt down neck.

The top is Engleman from Graham Hein and its been worked down to around 2.4mm thickness after feeding tap testing data into the various formulas in Trevor Gore and Gerard Gillets books.

The top has been braced up and next job is fitting the upper transverse brace. The falcate braces are laminated from king billy pine using techniglue epoxy resin.

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Wayde Christie · Post by **Wayde Christie** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:27 pm

Looking good.

Is that carbon fibre *under* the braces? I've only seen it applied to the top of the braces. Any benefit to doing it that way?

Cheers

jeffhigh · Post by **jeffhigh** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:20 pm

Under and over is the "Traditional" approach as per Trevor's book.

Trevor Gore · Post by **Trevor Gore** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 4:46 pm

It's "traditional" in that that is how Smallman did it from the '80's onwards. It was definitely needed in his designs as he used very thin tops and balsa for bracing, so the vast majority of the stiffness was provided by the CF.

In the designs I use, the height of the braces is still ~3 times the thickness of the top panel, so all the CF is still well off the neutral axis and so still does useful work.

Kamusur · Post by **Kamusur** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:01 pm

Looks good Martin and it shows what a good number 13 is.

Steve

auscab · Post by **auscab** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:18 pm

like

No 13, Nice .

I read somewhere here, that you built a new neck jig . I remember seeing one you built a fair while ago on WWF.
How is the new one better ?

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 8:49 pm

auscab wrote:like

No 13, Nice .

I read somewhere here, that you built a new neck jig . I remember seeing one you built a fair while ago on WWF.
How is the new one better ?

The new jig is less complicated than the previous one and the neck tenon side of the jig works alot better. Ill take a few pics tomorrow and post up same.

The biggest issue with the jig was getting a correct sized template guide for the router. I ended up sourcing a Bosch 5/8" guide from the UK but even then the frigging thing was too long and I had to take the hacksaw to it. Im currently in the process of testing the jig with some dummy necks.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 8:51 pm

It's so friggin' hot down here the bldi West Systems resin was gelling after about 10 minutes......this was the fastest CF tow layup Ive ever done!

auscab · Post by **auscab** » Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:22 pm

You have an air conditioned workshop for the humidity , does it not cool it down as well ?

I'd love an air conditioned small work space.
Id like to see the new neck jig pictures . I Have the plans and will do one one day.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:56 am

auscab wrote:You have an air conditioned workshop for the humidity , does it not cool it down as well ?
I'd love an air conditioned small work space.
Id like to see the new neck jig pictures . I Have the plans and will do one one day.

No air conditioner.....I have a dehmuidifier that I run when it gets damp. This time of year humidity stays steady in the shop at 45%.

Jig pictures will be up later on today. Got to get the bldi garden watered first before the heat hits here.....high of 42 forecast.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sun Feb 02, 2014 7:14 pm

The heatwave continues here in Adelaide. I got the wall fan cranked up in the workshop which made things bearable despite the 37 degree heat in the shop. Bracing of the top is complete and the back bracing is 95% complete. The upper back brace didn't glue down properly on first attempt so I ended up chiseling it off and installing a new brace.

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kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sun Feb 02, 2014 7:27 pm

Rob...I still have to set up the neck jig and get some photos. Ive just consumed a blender load of Strawberry dacquiri so working the camera is a bit of a challenge at present

auscab · Post by **auscab** » Sun Feb 02, 2014 7:39 pm

Sounds like a good idea .

I don't know why I thought you had air conditioning ?? I must have misread something a few years back.

The build pictures look good.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:49 pm

auscab wrote: Sounds like a good idea .

I don't know why I thought you had air conditioning ?? I must have misread something a few years back.

The build pictures look good.

You may have misheard me...

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needsmorecowbel · Post by **needsmorecowbel** » Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:57 pm

Lookin Good Martin!...
I'm holding out for the watermelons to get cheap in this heat. $2.60 a kg is just not acceptable...

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:47 pm

The hear continues here with a bushfire burning not far from my place most of yesterday. The car was packed and we were ready to head for the local refuge before they finally got the fire under control. Progress on the guitar has been slow but steady. The back has been braced up, the head and tail blocks have been glued in and the solid laminated upper linings made up.

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kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:58 pm

A bit more progress over the last couple of days. Solid top linings glued in along with tailblock splint.

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charangohabsburg · Post by **charangohabsburg** » Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:56 pm

Very nice Martin. I like those linings and the end block.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:42 pm

More progress on the classical:
Tailblock lining splice.

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Gluning in lower (kerfed) linings.

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Side splints glued in. The special clamping cauls make the side "bellow out" slightly.

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Back linings sanded to 15' radius ready for fitting of the back (top is 25' radius).

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Test fit of the back.

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Test fit of the top and fine tuning of the head block.

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auscab · Post by **auscab** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 12:21 am

25 ' radius on the back , what radius will it have on the front ?
And the sanding with the yellow paper on the flat board , that just gets the flat treatment down to the sound hole ? is that right ?

ckngumbo · Post by **ckngumbo** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 2:09 am

This is realyy a nice photo essay!
Thanks
Rob

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 9:19 am

auscab wrote:25 ' radius on the back , what radius will it have on the front ?
And the sanding with the yellow paper on the flat board , that just gets the flat treatment down to the sound hole ? is that right ?

Whoops my gaff...back is 15' and top is 25' radius. Good pick up there Rob!

Yes the upper bout between the neck and transverse brace (= soundhole) is flat.

auscab · Post by **auscab** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 3:34 pm

I have not read much on classical building , I skipped through one book quickly , So I thought you will be telling me something I did not know.
When you radius the sides for the top, and then flatten the upper bout , how do you know when it is flattened enough ? does it have to match the UT brace in flatness?

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:16 pm

auscab wrote:I have not read much on classical building , I skipped through one book quickly , So I thought you will be telling me something I did not know.
When you radius the sides for the top, and then flatten the upper bout , how do you know when it is flattened enough ? does it have to match the UT brace in flatness?

Rob,

This instrument has a bolt on/bolt down neck. On top of the neck block is another block of wood onto which the upper fretboard bolts down to. The surface of this block is flat.

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Ill be using a large caul when I glue the top down so this will ensure upper bout north of the UTB is flat.

I know the neck block is flat enough when I can lay a straight edge across upper bout and it touches the sides and top of neck block with no gaps.

auscab · Post by **auscab** » Mon Feb 17, 2014 5:19 pm

It's looking good ,
Ive got the books , but I will ask one more cause I'm lazy but interested right now .

The Neck block is not cut at 90 degrees is it ? It has a relief angle of 5 degrees ? or is it 2 degrees ?

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