Jig for cutting nut slots

[simso]

Putting the question out there

Has anyone made a jig to true / reprofile nut slots. One of my guys has a serious problem with trying to get it right. "A serious problem", its a year now and he still cannot do it..and we are only talking flat bottoms not the radiused ones like fenders.

If theres a jig or contraption of some sort or even ideas, Im open to make it.

Lets put it this way, If I cannot make something to help him do the job, then someones got to be let go.. and in this economic climate I dont want to do that.

Thanks

[Trevor Gore]

Shed nut slotting jig.jpg (49.79 KiB) Viewed 24132 times

Def. works, but may be OTT.

[simso]

Now thats getting serious

[Ormsby Guitars]

and in this economic climate I dont want to do that.

Thanks

Economic climate? Low unemployment... massive numbers of mining positions... hell, even I'm considering a mining position...

[Nick]

You are too good an employer Steve! My thinking is that it should be up to the employee to get it right, if he's not then he should be practising in his own time to get it right especially if repairing nut slots is part of what's expected of him as part of his duties. I served an apprenticeship, I was expected to be able to come into this with a certain degree of hand tool ability (i.e be able to file a flat surface, centre pop on the marks e.t.c). Not saying every trade requires this or it should be a benchmark.
If he's still struggling after a year (and it sounds like you've been extremely patient with him....a good job I'm not his boss! )& everytime he trys to repair one ,cocks it up then the cold hard truth is that he's costing you money. Personally I'd impress this upon him & tell him to practice on scrap every chance he gets if he still wants to be working in the repair business. That saying comes to mind "If at first you don't suceed then perhaps skydiving is not for you!"
Having said all that, short of Trevor's suggestion I can't think of anything 'simple' or that already exists that could be adapted to complete the task. It would still need some sort of slideways to keep everything straight & square & some way of holding the neck. Something could be built I'm sure tho if you are willing to invest a bit of time inventing & some capital in materials it could be done. I could probably come up with something & sketch it out & PDF it to you if you get stuck.

[P Bill]

I haven't done much repair. What goes wrong with a nut slot ?

[simso]

and in this economic climate I dont want to do that.

Thanks

Economic climate? Low unemployment... massive numbers of mining positions... hell, even I'm considering a mining position...

Yep, its getting difficult to get people perry. And when you have invested over a year of training in someone and there still missing the mark, well mmmm.

Nick. Thanks for that, Im in agreeance, I might as a last resort give him some homework, that is a set of nut files some normal files and a block of wood with some slots roughed into it, let him cut blanks for it, if no luck then I guess I have to face the inevitable.

PS for info takes him almost a day to cut a nut and reshape a slot and he still gets it wrong in the end. Should only take 45 minutes. Days wages to stuff it, is 200 bucks I pay and the blanks, hence why I was looking for a jig to help him out. Loosing money..... is not a good way to run a business.

[Trevor Gore]

PS for info takes him almost a day to cut a nut and reshape a slot and he still gets it wrong in the end. Should only take 45 minutes. Days wages to stuff it, is 200 bucks I pay and the blanks, hence why I was looking for a jig to help him out. Loosing money..... is not a good way to run a business.

How long does a compensated nut take him? Do you provide a sleeping bag?

Compensated nut.jpg (38.27 KiB) Viewed 24060 times

[nnickusa]

Sounds to me like you've been more than patient....$200 in wages? How much do you charge for this service? And, it's still not right?

Maybe, if he's really good at other stuff, then you ought to avoid assigning him this task, or, find someone who can do it......

I've been the boss of everything I've done over the past 30 years, and some people, no matter how much they want to do the job, and no matter how nice they are, etc, etc...are not suited to it....


But, if you're commited to the kid, how about a simple box jig that, when the neck is properly fitted, can be run thru with a router or laminate trimmer fittted with an appropriate bit? It could have radiused shims to accomodate a variety of fretboard profiles, that could be interchangeable, along with some sort of centreing mechanism.....Should be simple enough....You might even assign him THAT task for "homework."

[peter.coombe]

How long does a compensated nut take him? Do you provide a sleeping bag?

Jeepers creepers, what is so complicated about a nut? Like you say, it should only take 45mins (or less).

Peter

[simso]

Welcome to my world, not a kid either, 40ish. To me it seems simple enough, to my other guys same thing.

On my last legs with this situation, hence why Im asking. ?? How much do I charge, you really dont want to know, lets say Im loosing hand over fist, and clocking it up to ""training"", but training can only go on for so long

[nnickusa]

Steve, Not for nothing, mate...

When I was a builder, I sacked guys for less.... It's not nice, but it's life.... In business, losing money over a hack(I don't intend to use that term unkindly) is a fool's game...

Maybe task him to come up with the solution, as a last resort, or send him off....Man, it's YOUR money he's losing. He still gets paid.....

I've got an hour this morning before I go to work, I'll see if I can knock something up, and post a pic tomorrow or Saturday....Jig building should be part of this job, and that demands a bit of creativity...Never having thought about building a guitar before Christmas, I've accumulated a massive pile of jigs for various functions...

I've been guilty in the past of giving people too much opportunity to fail, at my expense. I don't do that anymore....Sorry if it sounds cold....

[Trevor Gore]

how about a simple box jig that, when the neck is properly fitted, can be run thru with a router or laminate trimmer fittted with an appropriate bit?

Not quite as simple as it sounds. That was some of the original thinking behind the tooling in the top pic, but you always get split-out one side or the other. The top pic has cutters that come in alternately from each side, rotating into the cut, therefore one LH rotation and one RH.

[Ormsby Guitars]

I have to say Im a bit like Steve. I held on to a guy for 12 months too long, because I felt bad letting him go. Unfortunately, he just didnt have the manual dexterity it takes to be fast, accurate, and ultimately i guess... successful? It brought me down going in to work, and I was unmotivated. That's not how I want to be with my business. He walked out one day after stuffing up an urgent job (got superglue all over a custom wound humbucker, then tried to sand it off... ruining the bobbins and scratching the poles).
One year on, and my monthly turnover is more healthy, my outgoings have dropped, and you simply can't keep me out of the workshop now

[simso]

Thats where I am now perry.

Im doing everything I can do keep the guy, but exactly as you said, I come in to work and its yeh... having to double check everything / redo it / if you miss looking at the end work, it becomes a retuned job. The other guys are fine, well one is still in his first few months of learning so thats fair.

[EricDownunder]

Just my two bob's worth, as an employer myself for the past 35 years I have noticed a decline in the interest of employee's and their positions and at the end of the day you have to stand firm to the suvival & profit of your business.

Now on the nut slot problem, on tele the other night I briefly watched a selling skit on channel 74 on a new revalutionary saw that's looks like a 4" angle grinder however it has two blades going in oposing directions leaving no chipping either side or end of the cut, a neet looking thing but the blade width would be fixed I'd say. Initially I thought it was a load of crap, now, I'm not sure.

[nnickusa]

Steve, the other thing you haven't factored in, at least in this conversation, is that return jobs can easily lead to a loss in repeat business....

Some guy who's had his guitar "fixed" and then needs to bring it back and lose it's use for a second time, will quite likely go elsewhere for work on other guitars/issues...

Regardless of the economic climate, people don't want that....

Where I live, my restaurant is OFF 40-50% on last year, because people aren't spending money. Why? when the economy is so good? All the crap on Tele about how bad everything is, the banks won't pass on interest rate cuts, etc, makes people very choosy about where and how they spend thier money...

In the small business environment, you can NEVER afford to alienate customers

I just let a little girl go, because after 4 weeks she still couldn't work the till properly. Crying, begging and all ensued....

Did I feel bad? Of course, I always feel bad letting someone go, they have bills, families, girlfriends, whatever, but in order to have the job, you have to be able to do the job....

Halfway done with my jig. Will have something by Sunday arvo....

[EricDownunder]

Those numbers sound similar to mine 40-50 per cent down an I'm in roofing manufacture. The sooner we get a government that will support small business the better we will be. Sorry I was dreaming there for a minute.

[Dave]

Steve theres a jig thats for sale on Ebay that should make the job an easy one for your employee.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Luthier-Tool- ... 2a1ceb870b

Dave

[simso]

J on tele the other night I briefly watched a selling skit on channel 74 on a new revalutionary saw that's looks like a 4" angle grinder however it has two blades going in oposing directions leaving no chipping either side or end of the cut, a neet looking thing but the blade width would be fixed I'd say. Initially I thought it was a load of crap, now, I'm not sure.

One of my guys saw that as well, we now have one, its a pretty nifty unit

[simso]

Steve theres a jig thats for sale on Ebay that should make the job an easy one for your employee.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Luthier-Tool- ... 2a1ceb870b

Dave

Thanks dave, I actually already have one of those, there designed to give a rough shape to the nut, but the same can be acquired with a piece of pencil on a fretboard as a guide

[simso]

I just let a little girl go, because after 4 weeks she still couldn't work the till properly. Crying, begging and all ensued....

Did I feel bad? Of course, I always feel bad letting someone go, they have bills, families, girlfriends, whatever, but in order to have the job, you have to be able to do the job....

Halfway done with my jig. Will have something by Sunday arvo....

I know what you mean, Will do anything to make the guys that work for me comfortable, example we have delivered subway to the shop for lunch every day (my shout), just so everyone eats well and gets a good feed.

But can only do so much, really hope your jig looks and works a treat

[Clancy]

Steve mate, if I was living in the West I'd be camped outside your shed tonight asking for a job.

[Allen]

Subway delivered...and someone willing to pay me to work on instruments......I might have to move to the west coast.

I've read through this thread and still haven't got a grasp on what this fellows problem is. We teach complete newbies how to make a nut and saddle, and do a proper set up in the last day of our uke course. I'm pretty sure that most of them walk away having the confidence to be able to tackle a set up to a off the shelf instrument or building their own after that one day and be able to produce acceptable results.

But back to the employee whom it's too hard to let go. I had an apprentice when I lived in Canada that showed up 30 minutes early every day. Stayed late without a complaint. Worked his ass of at full speed every minute of the day, BUT....just didn't get it. No matter how much time I spent with him working through the procedures, and asking if there was anything that he didn't understand, and him being able to preform the task at hand while I watched. The next day it was as if the last had never happened.

It took me 2 years to finally come to the realisation that it was never going to get any better. No matter how nice the bloke was, and how hard he tried...and believe me I've had so many apprentices that I've lost count, and none have tried harder than this fellow....unfortunately he just wasn't cut out for the job. And at the end of the day it is a job where the goal is to make money. Not a hobby.

[Nick]

I know what you mean, Will do anything to make the guys that work for me comfortable, example we have delivered subway to the shop for lunch every day (my shout), just so everyone eats well and gets a good feed.

Geez, I'm packing up the truck & moving out to oz...zee, west that is, Swimmin pools, repairin gittars & subway lunch.
Got any vacancies?