Compensated Nuts

woodrat · Post by **woodrat** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 1:54 pm

I was looking at a hand made guitar at The Guitar Factory in Gladesville Sydney a while ago and it had a compensated nut. Has anyone done one and are the advantages incremental or is there a big difference? I beleive that this is at the heart of the Buzz Feiten system too and there is another called Eartopia but they are patented systems. I am not sure what is patentable in the concept but I would like to hear if anyone has done one, what were the benefits and or drawbacks of them. Also another luthier I know said that if you bring the nut 1/2mm closer to the 1st fret you gain an intonation advantage. Has anybody heard of this?

Cheers

John

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 2:37 pm

Quote from an unnamed lute player...."Mmmmph.......compensation is for pussies!!!!!

No..only joking. Well Im actually half serious.....you reach a point where you have to ask yourself how far are you going to go trying to build a guitar that has perfect intonation.

For detailed discussions on intonation the GAL Big Red Books are a good start.

sebastiaan56 · Post by **sebastiaan56** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 3:30 pm

Im with Martin, compensation is a poor excuse for poor musicianship.

But there is an article here that goes into some detail http://www.mimf.com/nutcomp/index.htm

liam_fnq · Post by **liam_fnq** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 4:43 pm

i couldn't agree more. there seems to be so many variables that can affect intonation. how far are you gonna go to avoid all of these. something as simple as pushing the strings down harder against the fretboard can affect the intonation.
then again though, i'm a bottleneck man so i'm never bang on anyway.

Dominic · Post by **Dominic** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:15 pm

Woodrat, Harry Fleishman has an article in the GAL journal about nut compensation. He uses a radiused nut and there is a pic on the front and back of one of his amazing harp guitars headstocks. He concludes a discussion about a radiused nut,

"Is it mathematically and audibly perfect? No, nothing is; can't be done. Does it sound markedly better? Yes, as do several other methods..."

I'm not gonna argue with Harry.
Dom.

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:43 pm

Definition of a fretted stringed instrument......a lesson in averages and compromises.

woodrat · Post by **woodrat** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:51 pm

Dominic wrote:Woodrat, Harry Fleishman has an article in the GAL journal about nut compensation. He uses a radiused nut and there is a pic on the front and back of one of his amazing harp guitars headstocks. He concludes a discussion about a radiused nut,

"Is it mathematically and audibly perfect? No, nothing is; can't be done. Does it sound markedly better? Yes, as do several other methods..."

I'm not gonna argue with Harry.
Dom.

Thanks Dom, I will have to check Harry article out at a friends place who subscribes to GAL. I subscribe to ASIA's Guitarmaker so we swap and read each others as they come out. A symbiotic luthier arrangement!
Cheers

jeffhigh · Post by **jeffhigh** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:56 pm

Basically you can use a compensated nut in two ways

-To help get the notes on the first few frets in better tune in relation to the open strings (as per your tuner- equal temperment)

-To give a sweeter relationship of chord notes in common keys by using nut compensation and modified tuning standards (the buzz Feiten and earvana systems)

Many luthiers do move the nut forward, but by less than 15 thou not 1/2mm

Getting the nut slots down as low as possible without the string buzzing on the first fret is the most important first step IMHO

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Compensated Nuts

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