Hide glue of various kinds

[graham mcdonald]

There seem to be numerous European sellers of Rabbit Skin glue (should we abbreviate this to RSG?) who claim that it is made from bit of bunny, though Sebastiaans point that it would require an awful lot of rabbits makes a good point.

cheers

graham

[Kim]

Folks,

I moved these post out of the 'alternative finish' thread to here to keep things on topic to assist future reference.

Cheers

Kim

Craig,

If you are going to Durobond I would love to get some nitro and thinners...

and I was going to get some animal glue from Gerard unless someone can suggest an alternative source. The last lot I got was called Rabbit Skin Glue and that came from an art supply shop. I am pretty sure it is just animal glue that was been powdered a little rather than coming in granules and it has worked fine. I have used less than half a kilo in ten years but I am using for more and more things and a bow making friend wants to laminate some dried deer tendons using animal glue to the front of a bow which has split a bit (No, don't even think about asking for more details on that one)

cheers

graham

No worries Graham. Email me what you want & quantities from both places.

And I do know about the archery, my passion in younger years. Has he thought of wrapping a thong of wet leather around the split. When it dries it tightens nicely around the split.

and I was going to get some animal glue from Gerard unless someone can suggest an alternative source. The last lot I got was called Rabbit Skin Glue and that came from an art supply shop. I am pretty sure it is just animal glue that was been powdered a little rather than coming in granules and it has worked fine. I have used less than half a kilo in ten years but I am using for more and more things and a bow making friend wants to laminate some dried deer tendons using animal glue to the front of a bow which has split a bit (No, don't even think about asking for more details on that one)

cheers

graham

Rabbit Skin is different from HHG. It is used mainly for sizing in painting which is why it can be found at most art supply stores. My main concern with it would be not knowing what the strength of it is, compared to HHG.

Make sure you break up the tendons into strands before using. I'd use fish glue if only for the open time if you aren't going to use Smooth On.

Got a lead to a US supplier and ordered some 192gm glue, That should keep me going for the next ten years or so.

I suspect that Rabbit Skin glue (at least that which gets sold in this country) is just a refined hide glue, with few if any rabbits involved in it's manufacture. The Ubeaut website info on hide glue (taken from A Polishers Handbook, written by Neil Ellis, a book on finishing used in technical colleges) says that Rabbit Skin glue is just a powdered form of the smelly pearl glue, but the stuff I have been using for ten years or so seems a more refined product. It is remarkably unsmelly, has great tack and I have used it to make half a dozen fiddles, various repair jobs and other joints on guitar, bouzoukis and mandolins with no failures or problems. I have no idea of what it's gram strength is, and I think people can get a little too fussed by such things. At the same timeI have no idea of what is available as Rabbit Skin glue from art shops at the moment or where it comes from, as it was ten years ago that I bought the half kilo bag, or where it comes from. A little research to be done here I think

I suspect that this is yet another area where there is a lot of received wisdom, anecdotes and mythology mixed in with just enough scientific data to gently blur what factual information there is.

As ever stirring the possum a little

graham

Did a bit more googling and came up with a book called Conservation of Furniture on Google Books. They reckon the average gram strength of Rabbit Skinglue is in the order of 380-400 compared to the common animal glues which are in the 150-210 range. No problem about strength, if anything it might be a bit too strong!

Somewhere at home I think I have an old copy of Fine Woodworking which has an article on hide glue which I will dig out which from dim memory included a tour through a glue factory somewhere in the US

cheers

graham

Great information - sounds like a new "Hide Glue" thread could be in order!

I know that hide glue was a by product of gelatine manufacture here in Aus, a lot came from the defunct Davis Gelatine plant in Botany (remember the song " I like Aeroplane Jelly..."). Botany was also the source of most tanned hides and of course rendered animal fats such as lard and tallow. The industries clustered around the meat processors as that is where the raw materials came from.

The edible gelatine is refined using filtering and an alkali wash process which denatures the proteins to a degree. Most hide glue is siphoned off before the refining and crystalised. I suspect Graham is right about the rabbit glue being normal gelatine as I dont know of anyone who processes large enough quantities of rabbits to justify setting up a manufacturing operation. Mostly its pork and beef. Incidentally the ears and head skin are used to make gelatine, the rest of the skins get sold off for hides and blood and bone.

Just a speculation, maybe "Rabbit Glue" was named after "rabbet" the joint used in furniture and should really be "Rabbet Glue"

[Allen]

In case some of you folks don't know where to get Hide Glue at a reasonable price, this is the place that I put Graham on to. Many of us on the forum get our glue from them, and they're a great company to deal with.

Tools For Working Wood

I buy the 192 gram high clarity glue. It has almost no smell when made up, and doesn't even have a taste, at least not an objectionable one. Yes I've tried it.

I bought their 5 lb. bag, and I think it was around $70 AU landed on my door. The shipping was at least half the cost. but I won't need to buy Hide Glue again for 20 years or so.