A bit of progress on the Selmer/Maccaferri

[Mike Thomas]

Some of you may remember that a little while back I posted a few pictures showing a test run I was doing on laminating backs and sides for a Selmer/Maccaferri guitar. For me, it was really useful to show what I was doing, because of the value of the discussion and feedback that followed. Unfortunately, it was one of those threads that has gone missing as a consequence of the attack on the forum.

Although the back and sides that I produced were not initially intended to be made into a guitar, I have continued the building process with them, just to check if my jigs, templates and tools work o.k., and to give myself some practice before I get onto the real thing. So here are some pictures of what has happened so far.

Top showing bracing.JPG (102.75 KiB) Viewed 15114 times

Back and sides.JPG (115.07 KiB) Viewed 15114 times

Top view.JPG (120.63 KiB) Viewed 15114 times

Back View.JPG (159.18 KiB) Viewed 15114 times

I'll post a few more pictures tomorrow.

[Nick]

Glad to see this project back on the forum Mike & it was indeed a shame that what you had done thus far was lost as it was worth it's weight in gold as a reference.
Looking pretty sweet already, it's getting the heart rate up just looking at what you've done. Nice clean job on the soundboard too. Where did you get your label from or did that come compliments of Photoshop? Looks nice and authentic, the whole things going to be a thing of rare beauty when you've finished Any chance of a close up of that smart looking rosette?

[matthew]

Nice to see those insides. What are the things that look like chips missing from the linings?

[morgan]

Beautiful stuff Mike, glad to see some progress and keep it all coming. I lament every lost bit of Selmer/Maccaferri stuff on the forum so time to repopulate it. I'll have about a million questions for you

Have you decided on hardware for it yet? I'd really like to use the original-style closed tuners on mine but the various sources I have found are extremely pricey. Perhaps I'll splash for a one-off but I'll need to save my pennies.

Did you manage to source the custom thickness veneers for the poplar and mahogany?

Which spruce did you end up using?

Any troubles sourcing decent walnut?

Once again bravo on the progress. I have the impression that you are gearing up for a big production run of these, is this the plan?

[Mike Thomas]

Nick, thanks. The label I did on a CAD programme (Deltacad). I felt that I should stick something in this guitar to identify it. The design is kind of "Selmeresque", but I'd like to have something closer to the style of the original when I get to making one seriously. I hope to make at least a handful of Selmer/Maccaferris, because it's an awful lot of trouble to go to to make just one. And initially at least, I'd like to try to recreate the look and feel, and with a fair bit of luck, something approaching the sound, of the originals. The "working label" looks like this:-

Working label.JPG (72.9 KiB) Viewed 15007 times

And while we're at it, the headstock logo looks like this:-

Headstock with logo.JPG (145.49 KiB) Viewed 15007 times

The headstock logo was laser engraved locally by a trophy maker. The engraved design I then filled with a mix of artist's gold pigment and epoxy. The "Jazz 1932" is for the Grande Bouche, and refers of course to the year it was introduced. For a Petite Bouche it would be "Jazz 1936"

Headstock logo.JPG (112.91 KiB) Viewed 15007 times

And here's a bit of a closeup of the rosette. Don't look too closely.

Purfling around Soundhole.JPG (129.01 KiB) Viewed 15007 times

Matthew, thanks. The linings have those bits cut out so that the top braces extend snugly right to the sides. The linings are laminated.

Laminated linings.JPG (93.79 KiB) Viewed 15007 times

Morgan, I hope to get back to the computer a bit later tonight, and I'll try to answer your questions then.

[Mike Thomas]

A few more pictures. The first is taken from the side, in an attempt to show the shape of the top, with its characteristic pliage.

Side view showing pliage.JPG (138.92 KiB) Viewed 15005 times

The next pictures are of the neck. I have used carbon fibre reinforcement, rather than the Dural used in the originals.

Neck 1.JPG (148.66 KiB) Viewed 15005 times

Heel showing carbon neck reinforcement.JPG (137.03 KiB) Viewed 15005 times

Beautiful stuff Mike, glad to see some progress and keep it all coming. I lament every lost bit of Selmer/Maccaferri stuff on the forum so time to repopulate it. I'll have about a million questions for you

Have you decided on hardware for it yet? I'd really like to use the original-style closed tuners on mine but the various sources I have found are extremely pricey. Perhaps I'll splash for a one-off but I'll need to save my pennies.

Did you manage to source the custom thickness veneers for the poplar and mahogany?

Which spruce did you end up using?

Any troubles sourcing decent walnut?

Once again bravo on the progress. I have the impression that you are gearing up for a big production run of these, is this the plan?

Thanks Morgan. I might try to reconstruct some of the lost stuff on laminating the backs and sides, and repost it. To answer your question, first re hardware. On this guitar I'll use the Schaller tuners and Selmer style tailpiece from Stewmac, they're not expensive, and I'm sure they'll be fine. In future I'll use the closed tuners and better tailpiece, although I don't know which ones yet, probably the ones Dupont uses. They are not cheap.

I did manage to source some 1/16" thick poplar and mahogany veneer from Certainly Wood in the U.S. It's very nice stuff, and I can bring it back to the required .8mm or so on the thickness sander.

On the test run guitar I'm using a sitka spruce top. On the real thing I'll use European spruce, although I would like to try out some of Shane Neifer's Lutz spruce as a comparison.

I haven't been able to source any European walnut for necks yet, but I'm trying. American black walnut is a reasonable alternative, and so is Peruvian walnut. I got a few Peruvian walnut neck blanks from LMI, and they're pretty good, and not that expensive.
I would expect to make at least half a dozen of these guitars, both the Grande Bouche and Petite Bouche. As I said earlier, it's a lot of work to go to for only one.

[matthew]

Why do the braces need to run all the way to the edges of the plate into the linings?

(By the way - Hobart's a small world - do you know any of my Tucker siblings in Hobart? Martin the kora and piano player/tuner, Eleanor singer, had gig at the AlleyCat recently, and Paul is into heavy things?)

[Nick]

Why do the braces need to run all the way to the edges of the plate into the linings?

If I may Mike?
Support Matthew, it has that 'barrel' shape to the soundboard (which is only about 2mm thick) & is ladder braced (not as 'supportive' as an X bracing configuration) with the floating bridge which as you know, works more in 'pushing down' onto the soundboard rather than the twisting torque of a fixed bridge.So the braces are let into the linings which act as shelves to support the brace ends, similar to the ends of an X brace on a flatop. I suspect without letting right in that the top would collapse in very short order.

Very nice job Mike, I'm loving the authenticity of the build & that touch with the headstock logo...pure brilliance! It looks the bees knees, the dogs bollocks, e.t.c e.t.c. & as for the rosette, I've looked closely because you said not to All looks darn good to me. If this is "the trial run" model, I'd say you are going to make some pretty spectacular (& collectable) Selmer/Macs my friend .

[morgan]

Interesting that you chose to get the logo laser cut into the headstock. The original was carved with a pantograph tracing a larger metal template I believe. I was trying to figure out what would be the best alternative since that is not really an option for me. I was thinking of getting my logo made up as a stamp, using an arbor press to impress it on the wood, and then fill the resulting mark with gold leaf. I don't even know if this would be a good idea?

The cheapie option would be just to get gold decals made but I really didn't like that. I'm not sure what other viable options there are.

I hadn't really considered laser cutting (had just assumed it would be pricey) but may look into it.

Is there any reason you chose to go with carbon fibre reinforcing instead of simply adding a truss rod? I know the originals had aluminium reinforcing but if you are allowing yourself to deviate from that one tiny detail on an otherwise identical replica why not go for the benefits of an adjustable truss rod?

I think Nick hit the nail on the head - your guitars will be instant collectables.

I have resigned myself to the fact that I am running a marathon and not a sprint with my first build. Time and budget constraints, and bootstrapping from zero woodworking knowledge have made the progress painfully slow, but I am assembling a nice workshop as I go along and even if it is glacial progress at least there is some movement. You are certainly correct that gearing up to build the first one is the majority of the work

[Puff]

I thought I saw the holes for a twin rail truss rod in the carbon fibre

[morgan]

Ah yep, Puff looking at the pics you're probably right (it's me who is confused ) I read "carbon neck reinforcement" as the caption and didn't think that truss rods were made from carbon fibre so assumed it was just a some reinforcement embedded in the neck, similar to the original designs. However the picture does seem to show the end of a double-action truss rod?

[Nick]

I'm sure Mike will clear it up for us, but my read of it that it is indeed just CF re-enforcement (as Mike states in his description, the originals had two Ally rods runing the neck length of the neck & no provision for adjustment), the holes merely to lighten the already light CF even more without compromising strength.

[Mike Thomas]

Thanks everyone for your encouragement. And thanks Nick for answering Matthew's question about tying the braces into the linings. A much better answer than I could have given. And you were spot on too about the carbon reinforcement in the neck. No truss rod, just the carbon, which is made up of two 1/4'' square carbon rods, each with a 3/16'' hole up the centre. They don't need to be solid. They are plenty stiff enough as they are, and they are very light.

Morgan, your question about why did I use carbon instead of Dural is a good one. The main reason being that carbon is, I believe, a much better material for the job. It is lighter, stiffer, and glues well with epoxy. Aluminium glues very poorly unless it is surface treated e.g. anodised, due to rapid oxidisation of any exposed surface. Also, I am trying to persuade myself that if Mario Maccaferri had had access to carbon , he would have used it in preference to Dural. Carbon and Dural are both "high tech" materials of their age, Dural being the material of choice for the new age of aviation in the 30's. Having said all that, I shall certainly have a go with an aluminium alloy neck reinforcement for the sake of authenticity, and see how it compares. Although you can't get Dural now, there are very close equivalents in aluminium/copper/manganese/magnesium alloys available. For instance 2024-T3. I haven't contemplated using a truss rod, I'm hoping it will not be necessary. The Petite Bouche had no reinforcement at all, and I believe suffered as a consequence, so I shall be deviating from authenticity there.

The laser engraving of the headstock works well. The engraving itself was not expensive, $10 per headplate if I had six done, which I did. I just emailed the graphics file (.eps) to the trophy shop, and they did the rest. What can be expensive is getting the logo drawn up in a graphics programme if you have to pay someone to do it.

Matthew, I haven't met your siblings, but I shall certainly keep an eye out for them now. You're a musical lot, aren't you. Is Eleanor a solo performer, or is she in a band? And is Tucker her surname? And does Martin live in Taroona?