America's next President

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Bob Connor
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America's next President

Post by Bob Connor » Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:35 pm

What's the lowdown on these blokes and women who are in the running to become the next President of the United States?

There is a fair bit of press here in Australia about them at present (in fact there's a doco on Hillary and Barack is I type) but I wouldn't mind getting the skinny from some of you people on the ground over there.

Cheers

Bob

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Post by Dennis Leahy » Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:43 am

Well, we have multiple political parties here in the US, but only 2 with a snowflake's chance in hell of electing anyone to a major position.

For viable contenders to the throne, we have Republicans and Democrats.

The rest of this is my opinion, and I'm not very humble about politicians.

There is an elite group of people, not all of whom are Americans, and they really run the show here. (I suspect they run much of the show worldwide.) Let's call these people the Puppet Masters. I suspect their coalition is actually quite loose, and not so much like the lluminati/Bilderberg Group/New World Order conspiracy - they don't need clandestine behavior - it is all done right in front of our noses. They have created and sustained minions that have fought communism (equal sharing of wealth and power) and socialism (quasi-equal sharing of wealth and power), making communism the great evil of the 20th century, and making the word socialism nearly as evil. They own the printing presses, and the TV stations, and the radio stations, and own or control almost all universities, and control (through book printing) much of the curriculum of all education. Electing a few true progressive candidates to office will be nothing more than a bump in the road to the Puppet Masters. It might even be good to have a few ranting and raving liberal progressives making some noise to make the populace believe we are all represented.

This group, the Puppet Masters, funnels money into every candidate's coffer, so all are beholden to them for election and for reelection. The further an elected/purchased official deviates from the will of the Puppet Masters, the less likely they will be reelected or will live to see the end of their term in office (e.g., John Kennedy), and the more the official steers the course toward the will of the Puppet Masters, the more likely they will be reelected, regardless of how big a sociopathic monster they are or with how much of a dumbass demeanor they present themselves (e.g., George W. Bush.)

Here in the USA, the Republicans are the treasonous, warmongering, planet-raping, greed-fueled, oppressors, assassins, and war criminals that currently run this country. They have become masters of psychology and effectively use fear ("code orange!) and distraction ("the gays!" and "illegal aliens!" are destroying the country) to control and subvert the masses. Every deed they perform is evil and greed driven, but they have learned to embrace the words and phrases that allow them to appear (to the average, sleepwalking citizen) as if they are aligned with good, righteousness, justice, and god.

We're currently down to two Republican candidates, John McCain and Mitt Romney. Romney is about as smarmy and as believable as a used car salesman, and makes me want to wash my hands (and ears) when I hear him say the words he has been told to say. He would be perfect for the Puppet Masters, as he is as soulless as a real marionette. McCain is a curious pile of robotic and tortured human parts, occasionally appearing sane for a few moments between periods of insanity. Sadly, his period of captivity as a POW in Viet Nam left him with a sense that war is sometimes the proper tool to effect change, and has kowtowed to the Bush warmongering and support of the military industrial complex. He wants very badly to be the president, and will serve his Puppet Masters well if elected.

We are currently down to two Democratic candidates as well: Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. (Whichever of these candidates progresses through the gauntlet to face the Republican choice will get my vote in next November's general election, simply because they are not a Republican. Though I do place guilt by association on anyone who would align themselves with Republicans, I do not entirely ascribe innocence by disassociation to any Democrat - simply a lesser of evils.)

Either of these Democratic candidates will easily and nearly instantly uplift the view of the USA to the rest of the world, and to their credit, my view is that they both genuinely understand global partnerships with other nations rather than the current global bullying of other nations. As for the Iraq war, I think either Democratic candidate will end it quickly, but sadly, neither will pursue the actions of Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice as criminal or treasonous acts, nor will they attempt to reverse the war profiteering that has sent the USA into deep debt for many many generations. I don't know if they simply do not believe that they could successfully prosecute those monsters, or if their own ties to the Puppet Masters prevent it.

Some will jump up and down that Hillary voted (along with nearly every US Senator) to allow Bush to push forward on the Iraq war. Few recall that this was after a closed session (historically, very rare) of the United States Congress, and we may never know what lies Bush/Cheney and the other dominant Republicans told to persuade the vote. We know for sure the American people were lied to, and can only guess what the Senators were told behind closed doors in a sworn secret session.

Amazingly, the Republican spin machine has repeated their propaganda frequently enough that the average (somnambulant) citizen in the USA believes that Democrats "tax and spend" and "give free rides to freeloaders", while Republicans are fiscally responsible. This is still a major Republican theme even after the Republicans, in power for over seven years have elected to "borrow from the future" rather than heavily increase the taxes in the present, to allow themselves to spend TRILLIONS of dollars beyond the normal operating budget and the associated BILLIONS of interest dollars to fill the coffers of the Puppet Masters (especially the military industrial complex, but all of the empires of all of the Puppet Masters are enriched and strengthened.) But, by creating "debt" rather than raising taxes, the Republicans somehow still claim to be fiscally responsible. Amazing!

Imagine taking your credit card and spending blindly, wildly, and madly all the money you could. Then, hand the credit card to your business partner, take a golden parachute for yourself, step aside and let your partner deal with the massive credit debt. A few years later, you could come back to the board of directors, declare that your successor was a spendthrift, and ask for your old job back. That's exactly what is about to happen to the Democrat that succeeds in making it into the White House. What the Republicans have done to this country in general and what the Bush/Cheney regime has done specifically will haunt, impede, and cripple the Democrat who is handed the keys. With the deepening of the recession and maybe even a full economic depression, they will appear to be a failure, and will be an easy target for the 2012 Republican candidate to take back the keys.

This ebb and flow between these two major political parties, both bought and paid for by the Puppet Masters, is in itself part of the plan, and is yet another layer of distraction so that the average citizen never fully realizes how much of a pawn we all are.

Gee, Bob, what was your question again? :oops: Well, in spite of whatever specific dirt is dug up and dished out over Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, the winner will be a peaceful and relatively benevolent president who will rapidly be swallowed up in their inability to repair the damage left behind by Bush/Cheney. In just four years, even with the will and a powerful plan, no president could switch us over to hydrogen as a fuel from oil-derived gasoline, no president could repair the economic damage, no president could repair the failing infrastructure, no president could heal the divisiveness and psychological damage within the USA. (I know, Barack says, "yes, we can", but I have become very cynical.)

I know I didn't really address your question as directly as you would probably have liked, but I feel much better now.

Dennis
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Post by Ron Wisdom » Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:12 am

Guys in Minnesota have way too much time to think. :D That was a very thorough trouncing there, Dennis, and I don't disagree with it. I, too, believe that we must have either Hillary or Obama. I didn't like the Clinton's when he was governor here and I don't like them now. My choice would be Obama, then Hillary.

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Post by Allen » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:16 am

I believe you are spot on about the puppet masters controlling everything that people see, read and hear. Living close to the US/Canada border, we could get local US TV and radio stations, along with the local Canuck ones. What you saw on the US stations was certainly portrayed from a very skewed perspective, or not mentioned at all. Alas, the Canadian press was going down this path when I left, and I fear is now a carbon copy of the US model. Thanks to free trade and globalization, the puppet masters can control everything.

Just look at how the media laws changed in Australia since our own US /Aust. free trade deal came in. We are not far behind.
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Post by BillyT » Fri Feb 08, 2008 3:04 am

The American political structure is so twisted mostly by Americans themselves! We have an insistance in voting for "who we think" is going to win instead of the best man for the job! Denns's sad commentary is a prime example of this!

The grasp of politics leading to "I can't stand the Republicans so I'm voting Democrat" leads to the same kind of thinking on the Republican side and the inverse! His total lie he tells to himself concerning "puppet masters" shows he has no political reality at all! It is corporations, the wealthy self-interested that are the real puppet masters! Politicians can be bought quite cheap here and most Americans Dennis included(sorry Dennis) are so increadibly stupid and craven to address affective reality!

The Democrats complain because Bush takes out an incredible murder who attempts assasination on an ex-president and we do vitually nothing because the profoundly leftist media knows this is an act of war! Reports on it, not at all, because of this fact. The hypocritical leftist corporation has total charge of the media in this country so any divergent discussing is sqaushed in even the concept that there should be.

Typical politician Clinton lies to congress and the news media knows this is an impeacable offense, so the media turn the whole discussion into that of, blow jobs in the oval office, instead of discussing a president that should of been impeached out right. As much as Bush is poorly thought of here(and he is, let me assure you he is, and for good reason) what is never discussed is the American corporate news media's approval rating is even a whole lot worse than Bush's! Never reported in the news is it?

Corporate news actors broadcast a sick game of "Look at the celebrities butt" while a racist Mexican nation that will not allow Americans to own property outright in their country, so overburden our economy with their poor, that we are having real problems with financing infrastructure let alone development of the future needs of the country. They talk about the Mexican coming here to work and pay taxes! Oh yeah! how much does one Mexican baby cost the American medical system(meaning ourselves)! While an American cannot own property in Mexico? Where's the leftist indignation now about racism now?

The Democrats will not allow anything to get through congress considering this situation because most Mexicans vote Democrat. So they must put on the "we're concerned face", and vote any simple laws down under trumped up consideration for the poor! They don't give an F'in CRAP! Corporate news actor coverup by omission of fact! By misdirection in priority!

The Republicans don't want to cross their corporate fornicators because of the cheap wages allowed by hiring these people escaping there governments failed system but who still don't have enough sense that their government has betrayed them and still have real allegiance to there own government.

The main problem is most Americans, in real terms, are ready for war! Yeah!! Take out Iran blow'em to HELL! Syria next! Saudi next! France next! We're just not interested in occupation and we shouldn't be!

The dishonesty of the left in talking about Saddam not having WMD, when how many Kurd women, babies, dogs.... spent there last days writhing and bleeding from every pore from Russian supplied mycotoxins in a synthetic matrix tells the world they did and would use them! The real issue is the Democrat doesn't give a crap if murderers destabilze the whole world as long as it doesn't inconvience them and there so called sensiblilities!

The Republican uses the war to fatten already bloated pockets of the doubleminded corporate types so they can spend more money on undermining the process of democracy in "republic service".

It is so good that our founding father weren't like Americans today or the Democrat would be getting BF'd by their British masters while the Republican sold everything in rights of speech and dignity to the British for a few pennies on the dollar!

It is easy for the American to talk about how noble it is for us to kick out foreign oppressors but are so incredibly stupid, and yes, craven in selfishness in kicking out American oppression, the corporate royalty, let alone murderers! While thinking the Democrat or Republican is our only hope against the oppression of the Democrat or the Republican!

Health care? Gone! The Democrats and Republicans are owned by the CIIC, "Corporate Insurance Industrial Complex"! D.F. Hillary just stated when questioned about how she was going to finance her universal health care program by garnishing wages of those that can afford health care but won't purchase it! WHO THE EFF IS THAT? If Hillary gets in she's going to cram her inane agenda down people's throats and the leftist news media is going to look the other way toward their corporate leash! Forced submission to the CIIC Hillary's vision for America!

The CIIC will not allow any solution to the health care problems here because they are gouging everybody incredibly and Yes! Yes! Yes! the lying leftist corporate news actors who contribute 90% of their political contributions to the Democrats won't discuss their corporate masters for fear of slap suits and being owned by the CIIC itself! Yes, The Demopcratic news actors are CORPORATE and the democratic "R and F" think nothing of pointing dirty finger at Republican sellouts!

We have battery electric cars now that can fulfill 95% Americans tranportation needs but the way it works in congress if you don't give the money you don't get the money! Yeah! Yeah! Yeah! Democrat and Republican. So there is no real financing to alleviate our reliance on foreign oil "and" domestic corpoations that do pay the money!

Then our corporate news actors glancingly talks of "political contributions"... leftist speak for corruption!

Americans pay more in tax than the vaunted Eurpy high tax because we are taxed even before we are payed, by employee tax, then as we are paid then when we buy anything for our needs then for "Services"! Then we are stupid enough to fall for the Republican and Democrat "tax the failing middle class to pay for the poor" schtick while the wealthy walk away virtually unscathed!

The religious right is so concerned for voting for corporate lies that have any appearance of righteouness, at all, simply because they crave money! They claim faith in a Jesus Christ who lived in common with the poor, and worship, in real terms, the wealthy hypocrite! How can they vote for the wealthy when Christ was nothing like them!

Because the religious right is nothing like Christ!

Give your money to the poor and live like Christ and insist on your Republican thieves do to, so you won't all burn in hell! The religious right is so cracked up over voting for the self-righteous Republicans that nobody wants to have anything with Jesus of Nazareth because they think Christ looks like Christians! He doesn't!

Not pefect, just forgiven?

Guess again! Repent first !!! Give your excess to the poor and stop worshiping those that don't!

With wealth comes corruption! We suffer from it not by the corrupution of politics but of soul! Spirit of concern for one another is replaced by what's in it for me and cowardess in standing for others because a callous selfish heart craves position in this world! All so we, as a people, can vote for who has the best chance of winning!

Does that clear things up Bob? :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post by Ron Wisdom » Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:54 am

So, Billy, who should we vote for? And, my friend, take a nice warm bath and a nap, that explanation wore me out, so it must have wrecked havoc with you.

Ron

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Post by Dennis Leahy » Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:31 am

BillyT wrote:The American political structure is so twisted mostly by Americans themselves! We have an insistance in voting for "who we think" is going to win instead of the best man for the job! Denns's sad commentary is a prime example of this!

The grasp of politics leading to "I can't stand the Republicans so I'm voting Democrat" leads to the same kind of thinking on the Republican side and the inverse!
I was "Independent" for many years, and was registered with the Green Party for a while. I was among the .001 percent to vote for virtually unknown candidates that I truly felt were the best for the job. Funny thing is, they not only never won, they never even got close to being a blip on the radar. Billy, if you vote for someone who has no chance in hell of winning, then I salute you for sticking to your guns, but I can't do it. Not now, in 2008, with these particular Republicans in power. This group has redefined malevolence in action and it is more critical to wrest the power from their hands than it is to vote for "the best" candidate. Like I said, all these politicians have the same masters, but their MO is not all the same. Voting for ANY Republican, even Ron Paul, right now is a way of condoning the MO of this cluster of individuals at this point in history that happens to call itself the Republican Party.

BillyT wrote:His total lie he tells to himself concerning "puppet masters" shows he has no political reality at all! It is corporations, the wealthy self-interested that are the real puppet masters! Politicians can be bought quite cheap here and most Americans Dennis included(sorry Dennis) are so increadibly stupid and craven to address affective reality!
Re-read my words. I said I don't believe the Puppet Masters are an organized group. They are all enormously wealthy and powerful individuals, and are driven by self-serving greed to want more wealth and more power. You are mistaken that they are "corporations", though in many cases they own and/or control corporations. Corporations, due to the soulless nature, are ripe grounds for exclusive greed-based behavior, but those greed-based decisions are ultimately under the direct control of a few key human beings. All capitalism is greed-based, but most capitalist greed has limits. Allowing greed and thirst for power to define all decisions creates malevolent behavior that is magnitudes of order beyond simple greed. Make no mistake, the Puppet Masters are individuals, even though they own or control corporations and have wealthy families and empires.
BillyT wrote:The Democrats complain because Bush takes out an incredible murder who attempts assasination on an ex-president and we do vitually nothing because the profoundly leftist media knows this is an act of war! Reports on it, not at all, because of this fact. The hypocritical leftist corporation has total charge of the media in this country so any divergent discussing is sqaushed in even the concept that there should be.
Most Democrats supported going into Afghanistan after Bin Laden. Most sane people do not support going to war with Iraq after being attacked by a bunch of Saudi Arabians. Did Saddam deserve a bullet? You bet he did! But the dumbphuck Republicans fronted by Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld killed 300,000 civilians, destroyed a country, and destabilized a region of the world taking out one bad guy. That's like throwing grenades into a school full of children after we find out there is a gunman in the school that has killed a child. It's phucking insane behavior! And if you have any doubt that it was done for control of oil and to fill the coffers of the military industrial complex, just look at what the "goodhearted" Republicans have done about the ongoing genocide in Darfur! Phucking nothing, that's what!
BillyT wrote:Typical politician Clinton lies to congress and the news media knows this is an impeacable offense, so the media turn the whole discussion into that of, blow jobs in the oval office, instead of discussing a president that should of been impeached out right. As much as Bush is poorly thought of here(and he is, let me assure you he is, and for good reason) what is never discussed is the American corporate news media's approval rating is even a whole lot worse than Bush's! Never reported in the news is it?
Oh please, not the "Clinton should be impeached for lying about a blowjob" shit again! If that is an impeachable offense, then Bush and his crew should all be hung by the neck until dead for purposely lying to Congress and the American people, in order to start a war.
BillyT wrote:Corporate news actors broadcast a sick game of "Look at the celebrities butt" while a racist Mexican nation that will not allow Americans to own property outright in their country, so overburden our economy with their poor, that we are having real problems with financing infrastructure let alone development of the future needs of the country. They talk about the Mexican coming here to work and pay taxes! Oh yeah! how much does one Mexican baby cost the American medical system(meaning ourselves)! While an American cannot own property in Mexico? Where's the leftist indignation now about racism now?

The Democrats will not allow anything to get through congress considering this situation because most Mexicans vote Democrat. So they must put on the "we're concerned face", and vote any simple laws down under trumped up consideration for the poor! They don't give an F'in CRAP! Corporate news actor coverup by omission of fact! By misdirection in priority!

The Republicans don't want to cross their corporate fornicators because of the cheap wages allowed by hiring these people escaping there governments failed system but who still don't have enough sense that their government has betrayed them and still have real allegiance to there own government.
Hmmmm.... So I guess that old "Give us your tired, your poor..." shit is out?

There is a legitimate problem with overpopulation, especially in poor countries, and it is true that the US and many other affluent countries are the destinations of the overburdon of humanity. There are no simple answers, and a 50 foot high border fence with millions of suffering people one inch away from the affluent countries sure as hell isn't the answer. We Americans probably need to export trillions of dollars worth of Peace Corp type technology and knowledge, as well as massive amounts of birth control technology and knowledge, rather than spending the same trillions on our very own weapons of mass destruction. The world has grown too small for the US to be isolationist. Isolationism isn't just immoral and unethical, it will also bite us in the ass.
BillyT wrote:The main problem is most Americans, in real terms, are ready for war! Yeah!! Take out Iran blow'em to HELL! Syria next! Saudi next! France next! We're just not interested in occupation and we shouldn't be!
Sadly, you may be right. Approximately half of our voting citizens wanted Bush to lead our country again, after they already knew for sure who he is. So, if by "most Americans" you mean that group of sheep so easily led, then yes, I'd have to agree. But, there are quite a few sane Americans too, and even many of those who are sleepwalking through life are opposed to unprovoked war.
BillyT wrote:...With wealth comes corruption! We suffer from it not by the corrupution of politics but of soul! Spirit of concern for one another is replaced by what's in it for me and cowardess in standing for others because a callous selfish heart craves position in this world! All so we, as a people, can vote for who has the best chance of winning!
Not voting for whomever has the best chance of winning, but taking a sober look at all of the candidates that actually and really have a chance to remove the keys to the kingdom from the crime overlords currently in power (and just happen, at this moment in history, to be waving the Republican banner.) Maybe a few years from now, I can once again go back to being independent, and voting for the best person for the job, regardless of the futility of my effort. But right now, our country and our world need US voters to remove the current gang of criminals from office. When I said I would vote for whichever Democrat makes it to the "ticket", it is not said while ignoring some Democratic monster. Obama and Clinton may not be anything great, but (from what I currently understand about them), they are not malevolent - and that alone makes them 1000 times better than re-electing Republicans, thus condoning Republican policy.

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Post by BillyT » Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:24 am

Dennis don't get me wrong! I'm like most Americans pissed as hell! I admire your approach but voting Democrat is part of the problem! I vote for whoever I think the best man is it isn't if it's a Demo a Depublican or an independent!

For example Domino sugar a few years back gave some $610,000 to the Democrats and some $490,000 to the Republicans! So where's their political concern? There isn't! It's a bribe! Don't touch anything that we don't want you to touch!

That is the real problem American polititians, bought and paid for! Even the Red Chinese can buy American politicians and the do! This John Wong thing from years ago is prime example of this!

I.E. all the ads on television, newspapapers and magazines? Bribes...nothing more! "We're your biggest advertiser don't investigte the FDA/pharmo interests"! And they don't! Yes the hypocrisy of our vaunted leftist concern for man's welfare! What a crock!

Yes Dennis vote for the Demo who's going to win and you'll probably lose anyway and corporate liars still control congress, newspapers,TV, magazines, attorney... courts and yes you !!

I switch back and forth on primaries to vote to the most pressing issue as needed! I was democrat to vote against Jerry Brown for years then switched back to Republican for Ron Paul but I pretty much vote away from Democrat or Republican depending on the offerings!

What pisses me off so much is such a "great concern" for our American troops by the Left because 3 Troopers died today in Iraq! Oh My! Such a tragedy! How many women children died on American highways let alone in Chad or Darfur. It's a back handed tack to say I told you so when people wanted to kick Iraq crap and still want to kick Iran crap! These people are facist killers and won't stop unless stopped! It's a way of getting their way just like in Vietnam constantly twist the war around while cowardly politicians don't step up to the plate and take care of business!

The real concern for the poor and disaffected by the left is a load the problem with Mexican poverty is with Mexican politics and it's an American one now! We don't have free land to gve out to whoever come here anymore! This is not the 1800's Most countries have severe restrictions on immigration for reasons! We have responsibility to take care of their poor but no responsibilty to correct the problem at the source, No I disagree!

We don't need a fence let them come here all they want just ship them back after fining the crap out of anybody that hires them! They have responsibilties in their own country first! Again priorities!

This is it! A people this profoundly politically cowardly and stupid cannot mantain their liberties! That's it! As long as the recognition is not there against the wealthy self-interested all of these problems and more will worsen until yes we have war right here in the ol USA! Talk about morality then when the jack boot come to your door! Talk about the immorality of war then!

If Americans don't stand for their families, neighbors friends and yes personal enemies no one else will!

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Post by sebastiaan56 » Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:48 am

Hesh1956 wrote:And to all you freaking foreigners :D if you think that you don't suffer from the same BS in your countries you have been sniffing CA for far to long.............

Enough of this crap I am off to water board my dog Sony - he smells like American politics.........
Guys,

We do suffer from the same BS. In fact the whole planet is infected by the disease. The old saying is that you elect a representative but you end up with a politician.

But to the point, Hesh If you are having those fantasies about Hillary you need some new gloves my man. Id be after your dog before her. Obama, well he's cute but boys are not my thing. It really makes a friend of mines philosophy that you always vote for the candidate with the biggest breasts. So Hillary it has to be....... or her daughter.... (sleazy slurping noises).

As for the sell out of values. Once again you are not alone. We just got rid of a duckhead called Howard. His idea of mateship was giving the media oligarchs in the country the right to eat each other up the profit tree. And anyone who didnt meet his middle class white profile was either a dole bludger, a terrorist or a single mother ripping off the social security system.

Ive always held that the politicians that inflict their pathetic selves on a country are not a true reflection of the people of that country, Im probably wrong, but it makes me feel better. I dont have the answer for this sorry mess, I wish I didnt have to participate but Ive got kids and their future matters. If I had real balls Id get mixed up in it but then Id be one of them (echos of Groucho Marx).

Can I watch the waterboarding?, its part of toilet training isnt it? Imagine Hillary in a collar....... oh... oh......

edit. I write this post and the button says submit, its a wierd world......

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Post by Kim » Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:45 pm

Look! Babra's got 2 of em. :D



Image


Cheers

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Post by Allen » Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:59 pm

I want to take a moment and give Bob a big round of applause for starting this. It's turned out to be one of the most interesting reads I've had in weeks.

And Hesh....she makes my skin crawl. Now Monica.... :lol:

edit:

Kim, you posted while I was composing. I nearly spit my beer all over the laptop. Your a very baaaad man. :lmao
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Post by Bob Connor » Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:25 pm

Maybe I should have asked about something contoversial. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Thanks for the passionate replies.

You blokes obviously have a deep concern for the future of your country and the planet and I sincerely hope it does not end up as bleakly as anticipated.

I have found the entire thread extremely educational.

Thanks to everyone.

Bob

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Post by Paul B » Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:51 pm

The scary part about democracy is that it only takes just over 50% of the vote to win.

Fair enough, you might think.

However; 49.9% of the population is of below average intelligence, by definition.

At least 0.4% of any population are total wankers. These might vote either way.

There's your majority. :shock:

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Post by Dennis Leahy » Fri Feb 08, 2008 11:31 pm

Paul, come and visit the USA and see for yourself: there are a LOT more than .4% total wankers here! I'd move that decimal place at least two places to the right.

On a couple of close/stolen elections here over the past decades, Americans got a lesson again in the strange way that popular vote is "translated" into a presidential victory. We are definitely not a democracy, especially in the vote for the president. For the lower offices, we democratically vote for a representative that then thanks us and goes about their business - many times completely ignoring the majority opinion of their constituency.

Oh, and Kim: thanks for showing me Laura's bush. Genuinely nightmare inducing. Looks like she needs a lawnmower to trim that thing. And Hesh's dog Sony is looking better and better.

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Post by Dennis Leahy » Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:05 am

I made an error of omission in my original post, and we were down to 3 Republicans, not 2. The third is Mike Huckabee. Huckabee seems to be a pretty personable guy in his "sound bytes" and televised appearances, but is just another ultra-conservative dickhead isolationist, fence-building, Iraq war supporting, fear-utilizing, warmongering, homophobic, religious zealot. No surprise his previous job was as an evangelical preacher. As I write this, Romney has dropped out of the race, citing the need to keep a Republican in office, otherwise, "the terrorists win." (Yes, he really said that.) So, it is possible that the one candidate that I forgot to mention (I thought he had dropped out), could end up to be the dark horse.

I'm not really sure who specifically authored the "training manual" for right-wing ultra-conservative groupthink, but it seems clear that the training is effective. I am convinced that most of these ultra-conservative right-wing self-appointed saviors sincerely believe the words they have been programmed to utter.

It used to be a standing joke when some kid graduated from college with a degree in psychology. He or she would be flipping burgers at McDonald's soon. But now I suspect that those psyche majors have been very employable, and that many have been employed for many years in everything from advertising to "news" writing and reporting to lobbying to policy making to "black-ops/psyche-ops." Seems to me these folks have done their jobs pretty darn well, and the intent and will of the individual Puppet Masters has been effectively filtered down through the masses for generations - thus creating individuals who believe they are "free-thinkers" but who have in fact been orchestrated and programmed.

To a degree, we probably have all been programmed, or at least influenced by the programming intent. The degree to which that programming has been accepted/integrated or rejected defines how well we individually are espousing and promoting the will and intent of the Puppet Masters. My job, in this upcoming election, is to try to find the candidate that has rejected the programming to the highest degree, and has a viable chance of being elected.

Dennis
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Post by sebastiaan56 » Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:38 am

Dennis Leahy wrote:I'm not really sure who specifically authored the "training manual" for right-wing ultra-conservative groupthink, but it seems clear that the training is effective. I am convinced that most of these ultra-conservative right-wing self-appointed saviors sincerely believe the words they have been programmed to utter.
There are a number of conservative think tanks and a lot of the rhetoric comes from them. Our main one here is the Centre for Indpendent Studies. These places tend to be full of academics who feed each other the same shyte and publish their utterings to the world. Fukayama was deep in it till he woe up a bit. Lefties do the same, although as one commentator here put it "they seem to have more fun". On both sides the spin meisters have to a large degree defined the language of the debate and its content. I remember hearing a speech from Rumsfeld (I spit on him and his camel) where he said "we will tell you what to believe, when to believe it, how to act and you wont know the truth". True post modernism, 1984 made real.

Ive always been flabbergasted how your candidates so openly wear their religion on their sleeves. Here if someone admitted it they would still be spruiking their party line and we would be glad that their therapy was helping. That said we also have an ultra right religious loony element who always get a couple of seats somewhere and are a proper PITA when the government of the day wants to woo them. Our RU486 debate was a real eye opener as to who was tied to which religious conservative constituency.

To me voting for the openly religious would be like voting for an ayatollah. I know that in some areas of the US there is the equivalent of sharia law in place. Drug, alcohol and sex laws are amazing. Ive heard of kids playing behind the shed ending up on published pedophiles lists at age 15!
My job, in this upcoming election, is to try to find the candidate that has rejected the programming to the highest degree, and has a viable chance of being elected.
Good luck, they are out there, they will be regarded as the loonies by both the left and the right. They probably also wont have much media support because the media like simplistic copy so they can cut to a commercial break. The rise of the one liner is the testament to this.

Still, there are a lot of very bright people in the USA. Is there a green party of note?

Sebastiaan

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Post by Allen » Sat Feb 09, 2008 5:10 am

I don't think that I'll ever get to the point where I can wrap my head around how much money is spent just on the lead up to the US election. I had to listen to the blurb on the ABC radio yesterday 1/2 dozen times before I was positive that they said Romney used $50 million of his own money just to get where he had to drop out.

I thought he was a bright guy. From what I've seen and heard, the Republicans don't have a snowballs chance in hell to get back in, so any sane person would be saying that's just throwing money down the drain. Maybe that kind of money is easy to spend when your a billionaire, and he probably has some bright tax guys who can turn that around into a windfall.

Or here's another thought. Getting into office is such a lucrative way to line your pockets, that everyone pulls out all the stops in order to get in. :cry:
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Post by Larry Davis » Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:18 pm

This is the coolest forum on the internet(s)!!!!!!!!

My observation of the American political problem is apathy. We have become so fat arsed lazy and have lost our way of right is might. Ethics be dammed so long as "I get mine"!!! We have long turned over our destiny and lives to the politicians because "they know what's good for me" and long as I get my electricity, big car(s), big house, glutton eating habits, sense of self deserving screw the other guys and countries. APATHY!! We've closed our eyes to corruption so long as we get ours and now it's snaked it's way down to the lowest school board members. Just sit in on a school board meeting and listen to them talk about what's good for them and not what's good for the kids.

This cannot be fixed without sacrificed from all the citizens collectively. This cannot be fixed quickly.... certainly not with the next president alone. Get out on the street corners and in front of the federal courthouses and wave those banners of protest..... March down the street as a collective citizen protest group. Fire the bastards in Washington and stand up for right again!!!

Jeez...I don't know whether to get excited or nauseous with the Laura photo...
Still searching for the mother of all figures.

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Post by sebastiaan56 » Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:53 pm

Larry Davis wrote:Jeez...I don't know whether to get excited or nauseous with the Laura photo...
Welcome Larry, you sound like my kind of sick puppy wood nut!

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Post by BillyT » Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:06 pm

March down the street as a collective citizen protest group. Fire the bastards in Washington and stand up for right again!!!
Amen!

I hope I didn't come across too strong on Dennis this is not a Dennis problem just diffferent searchs for the same problem.

Dennis I admired what you said to Serge about the religious things. Serge means well but I'm sure there are things he doesn't want to see about not so much religion but church evils! You have a right to be concerned and angry!

I wouldn't trust Huckabee if you held a nailgun to my head!

Ron! That's the struggle I'm going through right now! Who do we vote for!

I wanted to say something, I voted for Perot, Yea even after he wigged out! A friend of mine stated "Well I hope you know you guys like you just put Clinton in office"! As much as I distain Clintons Whitewater dealings media coverup and "don't ask don't tell crap", I would still vote for Perot again! The relief in voting for a man on priniciple not on some need to feel like I won was such an uplifting, if not even scary feeling, at first! I highly recommend it!

In short, I don't see any easy solutions or quick ones either at least without serious sacrifice!

Kim! You are a bad man! :D :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post by BillyT » Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:16 am

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Will do!

First! I'm working on a pic of you and Hillary! :shock: :shock: :shock: :D

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Post by Serge » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:59 pm

Well, this thread wouldn't be complete if i would not bring my Christian side of the equation right? :rolf Thanks Bob, great thread folks!

The world promotes that you have to be yourself so here i am, having Jesus in my heart and living in His Love Joy, His Grace, Mercy and Peace, Amen!

Dennis is right on the conspiracy side of things, there are such things as the biderbergs, the UN lucists, secret societies, freemasons, illuminatis, world banking cartels, political assassins groups led by satanists who clearly worship Satan, who offer their children as sacrifice to false gods and who infiltrate organized religions and which will promote anything that is contrary to the values of Heaven but Thank You Lord Jesus, we will be free of these criminals soon, very soon.

I have been there and searched almost everything in that field, it is still on the human level of things though, truth or partial truths, deception, lies, corruption, groups of interests with collective or personal agendas and as individuals, there very little you can do because they have the means and the apparatus to shut you up in a heartbeat and they have a clear goal of reducing the earth's population because they prefer sea mammels who don't argue with them, when you think too much and talk too much, you become a threat to them.

Are we and have we been programmed you asked Dennis? You betcha sir we've been, you want to be free from that invisible slavery Dennis? Well then my friend, start by shutting off that TV set for good and it's commercial influence, your credit cards will be paid off in a heartbeat, you will start being content with what you have, happiness is in the simple things, we humans complicate life a lot, I debriefed myself by reading the Bible, the values of family and Love come from there BTW! :D

And Billy dude, if there is one pal you have who understands what christianity and christians have done to hurt and offend people in this world, it's me, maybe have i judged people wrongly in the past? If so, i really apologize to you or to anyone, i am not perfect but Christ in me is and Christ would welcome anyone here as they are, he hates sin but last i checked, He still love sinners and i am one of them who repents moment by moment, daily so i just know He loves us all in spite of who we are.

Conservative or right wings don't really matter to me, what matters to me nowadays is who these people serve for the Lord said:

Choose this day whom you will serve.

Well, history has it that some humans would rather follow the values of Satan(lust for power, greed, idolatry, coveting, pride, etc) and we are having a messed up population in the whole wide world that are paying more attention to their pets than to their fellow man, that worship the creation rather than our Holy Creator and from the beginning of time, it's been the same old story, God's response was always immediate, He's been telling humanity to seek His face with all of our hearts and He would reveal Himself to us. Sadly, sin blinds people and God lets them have it their way because He doesn't need robots, rather, like a Father does, He patiently waits for us to turn to Him as trusting and loving children would do with their earthly parents.

Billy, you have part of the solution in your text which is the word repentance, the other i would bring would be "prayers" because He still answers them, i have been seeing miracles ever since i came to Him as i was in the warmth of my apartment with a sincere heart and the joy has not departed ever since.

This is not about belonging to a religion nor is it about belonging to any churches of "christendom", it is about having a personal relationship with Jesus and walking/talking with Him, a relational knowledge of Who He is. If we all repent and start praying again in the privacy of our own homes, healing will come in our lands.

Best

Serge
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Post by Dennis Leahy » Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:58 am

Serge, I want to make sure I'm not misquoted (or have you agreeing with something I didn't say), and to tell you that in all due respect, prayer is not the answer.
Serge wrote:Dennis is right on the conspiracy side of things, there are such things as the biderbergs...
What I said (maybe I was not clear), is that there are individuals who pull the strings of every official elected (or inserted) into office. Some may have gossamer threads attached; most have stout ropes. In other words, the US presidency is important, but not really the be-all and end-all of world influence and power that we are led to believe. I suspect that the real recipe for becoming a "Puppet Master" is to have immense resources of wealth, and a malevolent level of greed and thirst for power. I DO NOT believe these individual Puppet Masters are in organized concert (or consort) with one another, other than a loose confederacy. I don't believe in satan or any other devil, and I doubt these greedy bastards do either. Their actions may be described as demonic or evil or diabolical, but those are just words. We use those words the same way George Lucas used villains in Star Wars that looked like nazis - it just quickly gets the point across.
Serge wrote:Billy, you have part of the solution in your text which is the word repentance, the other i would bring would be "prayers" because He still answers them...
... If we all repent and start praying again in the privacy of our own homes, healing will come in our lands.
Unfortunately, telling people to pray IS a part of the problem - a BIG part, here in the US. If millions of people believe that "god works in mysterious ways" and that god allowed Bush and his cronies to rise to power to do "His work", and that god is watching and listening and protecting us and "delivering us from evil"... THIS is the shit that placates people into submissive behavior and perpetuates holy wars!

If your sister was being raped, what if I told you to "wish upon a falling star", and it would all be better?

If your brother was being tortured in an undisclosed US black-ops detention camp, what if I told you to toss some coins in a wishing well, and he would be just fine?

If your children were dying of starvation and AIDS and I told you to hold hands and pray for manna from heaven...

I'm defining prayer as: "the act of asking god for something, and then waiting for it to happen." Wikipedia currently has it as:
"Prayer is the act of attempting to communicate, commonly with a sequence of words, with a deity or spirit for the purpose of worshipping, requesting guidance, requesting assistance, confessing sins or to express one's thoughts and emotions. The words of the prayer may take the form of a hymn, incantation or a spontaneous utterance in the person's praying words. Secularly, the term can also be used as an alternative to "hope"."

Passive and submissive behavior, fostered by prayer, is NOT an effective strategy to create world peace (or even regional stability), end world hunger, or promote environmental harmony. Those endeavors require ACTIVE participation, active protest, and a unifying message of tolerance. Praying to god to "clear up someone's errant thinking" and bring them to the "one true god" (whichever one the supplicant believes in) is divisiveness, not tolerance.

Note that I usually don't "bust" anyone for praying, as I generally think of it as a harmless psychological self-comfort tool. However, RELYING on prayer, or waiting on god to fix the shitstorm we have created here on Earth is insanity. Sorry if I offended anyone with that, but that's how I see it.

Dennis
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Post by sebastiaan56 » Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:50 pm

That is intersting Hesh, I didnt think Photoshop could increase resolution like that. Maybe I should pray for my copy to be able to do it!

Paul B

Post by Paul B » Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:59 pm

Billy, for god's sake put some bloody pants on!

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