Baritone Ukulele design

[Alan]

As a would be instrument maker but largely a nylon string, fingerstyle guitarist, as well as being a senior citizen, I joined a Uke group. Being a bit lazy (not wanting to learn GCEA uke chords) I purchased a Tanglewood Baritone Uke which when I bought it had re-entrant DGBE tuning. Not liking the re-entrant high D 4th string I put on a string set with a low D (I am a guitarist after all). BUT..... the low D sounds dead (actually the whole Baritone is dull and boxy in tone but the low D especially). I have been unable to find a good Baritone Uke in any of the Music Shops I have visited but, having read some of the information on ukulele resonance issues posted by South Coast Ukuleles in the US, where they state the resonant frequency of Baritone Uke is around D sharp, I am wondering if all Baritone Uke's will have a dull low D because the D is below the resonant frequency of the instrument. What I want is a Baritone Uke with solid, full bass notes and bright trebles, like a good classical guitar - am I asking too much. Finally, could the bass resonance be improved by increasing the body depth while maintaining the Baritone shape? All thoughts would be appreciated.

[Allen]

It's always going to be a compromise to some extent. The bod size is one, but the most important is the scale length.

I build a lot of baritones with 50% going for the DGbe tuning. In fact I have two on the go right now. One is going to be a 6 string at D, Gg, b, ee and the other in G, C, e, a.

You have to increase the scale length to get the tension up on the D string from what most factory baritones will be built on to support that tuning, and then very careful choice of strings. I build mine on 22" when asked for that tuning.

If you are going to start messing with the size of the body, then be sure you can find a case that will fit it. My baritones are a snug press fit into the cases I use.

Alternately, man up and learn to play GCea. In case no one has told you, if you put a capo on the 5th fret of a guitar, your first 4 strings are GCea

[Alan]

Hi Allen,
Thanks for your comments. I really like your ukulele's often checking your website and enjoying your FB posts. 22" is a long scale for a Baritone - almost a Tenor Guitar scale length. I guess it could be described as a long scale Baritone.
I enjoy playing Baritone, we have only three in our large Uke Group (TUG's in Canberra) so I am often looking for a fingerpicking pattern or strum to contrast with the 50+ GCEA's. At the same time I find it a little frustrating as we play a lot of pieces in the keys of G and C and, as a guitarist I am looking for a low G or C as the root note of the chord/s. However, my el cheapo plywood Baritone is dull against the higher register of the "normal" uke's, without the fullness of the bass notes that I am used to with the guitar. I have one average, one good and one very good classical guitars but all of them are much better than the Baritone Uke.
I guess I could go back to the re-entrant G tuning with the octave high D and get used to the more ukulele sound.
Yes, and I could get a normal GCEA uke - but I like the longer scale length of the Baritone.
What i am interested in is the newly advertised Cordoba Mini - a baritone uke size and scale length, wide neck guitar tuned ADGCEA like a uke with two lower strings. I could then play my classical guitar and fingerstyle pieces albeit five semitones higher and use 6 string uke chords allowing more root notes missing on standard 4 string ukes.
The trouble is my interests and my retirement income are at odds.

[Allen]

I know several people that started out with those Tanglewoods and came to the same conclusion as you have.

I've built a couple of Guitalele's on my baritone body and tuned A-a. More formally you might call them a Requinto guitar. There are photo's on my website and one for sale but on hold for a fellow.

If you search for those strings, you will find a few offerings. I use D'Addario's on those instruments.

If you want to try D'Addario J68's for D-e tuning, they might be an improvement

[Alan]

Hi again Allen,
I was wondering how you got a 22" scale with a a Baritone body but I note from your website pictures you are using 12 frets to the body rather than 14 and this keeps the bridge in a good place on the soundboard. Also are you Baritone bodies a little larger than normal?
Given I only paid $150 for the Tanglewood I can't expect too much. I bought it to see if I would fit in with the Uke group. It turns out that I love the camaraderie of meeting and playing with TUG's but tear my hair out with the dullness of the Tanglewood.
I originally put D'Addario EJ88B's on it but was still dissatisfied so I put J68's on it last time because I noted that set had heavier gauge D and G strings and I thought the greater string mass and tension would help but I haven't noticed any real improvement - hence it must be the Tanglewood's plywood top and/or the smaller soundboard size and body volume - hence my original question.
I would like to find a good Baritone to see if my expectations are too great but the few I have found in Music shops are much the same as the Tanglewood.

[Allen]

I have no idea at all what a normal baritone body is. Mine was designed to get the largest instrument I could to fit the case I use.

Baritones are 10" across the lower bout, 14" long and 2.75" deep.

It's a pretty versatile size. I use it for regular CGea baritone ukes. DBge baritones with a stretched scale. Tenor guitars, and Guitaleles.

With 22" scale I go with 14 frets to the body. On 21" my body shape is designed to go with a 12 fret body join, but stretch it to 13 frets when a client says that they just can't live without good access to the 12th.

[Alan]

Hi Allen,
Many thanks for your input on Baritone's.
I am shooting up to Sydney tomorrow to check out a Cordoba Baritone. Cordoba's make some quite good classical guitars so maybe it might be a little better than the Tanglewood.

[Donovan]

Aloha Alan,
One thing you might want to try is to make the sound hole a little smaller. David Hurd, who is cited in that South Coast ukulele article you mentioned, has a similar story in his book, page 120, except for a low g tenor which had a "thunky" g string. He suggested that the air resonance of the body was too close/nearly equal to the open g string frequency thus leading to the possible rapid decay. He cites Fletcher and Rossing 1998 where they provide a formula for the variables affecting air resonance (Helmholtz frequency). Long story short we can control two of the variables, sound hole radius and volume of the body. Your instrument is already made which leaves you with making the sound hole smaller as the only option, unless you can control the speed of sound (the third variable). This worked for Kawikas tenor. Making the sound hole smaller will lower the air resonance which should improve your situation. Kawika made a "plug" which decreased the radius by 1/8". Let me know if you try it and if it works.

Donovan

[Alan]

Hi Donovan,
Thank you for your thoughts on Baritone Ukulele design. Since the original post I have sold my Tanglewood and purchased a Cordoba Baritone. The Cordoba has a solid Spruce top and laminated Rosewood back and sides (typical classical guitar tonewoods). The Cordoda is quite a bit of an improvement on the Tanglewood but the low D string is still duller than I would like. I am trying different strings but, may in the end, fit a re-entrant high D and enjoy a more uke like sound. I think I am expecting too much to want a Baritone with tone and sustain like a Classical Guitar given the much smaller soundboard, scale length and soundbox volume. The Cordoda is fine to play in our 50+ member Ukulele group. Meanwhile I will still keep plugging away at making a Baritone too see what I can come up with. Despite being a Senior citizen and a long time guitarist there is so much to learn about the design and construction of fretted instruments. I will keep ypur suggestion of reducing the size of the soundhole in mind and may even be able to do some experimentation with the Cordoba.
Cheers
Alan