Piezo discs vs K&K

[jeffhigh]

Well I have quite a few guitars that I want pickups in.
I have one with K&K's pure western and installed another in a client's guitar the other day, really like the sound.
I tried to get K&K to give me luthier status so I could stock and do installs and promote them locally but they would not.
I really do not want to pay retail now.

So I got wondering, is there really any difference between these
http://cgi.ebay.com/25pc-20mm-piezos-w- ... 27b5822a1b
and the k&k's other than a bit of plastic moulding on the back and the convenient premade wiring.

Any thoughts?

[DarwinStrings]

Now that is a good question.

Jim

[sebastiaan56]

I just bought some piezo film off Experimental instruments website. Im looking forward to trying them out,

[woodrat]

Hi Jeff, I just bought a K & K pure western mini from the Australian distributor on eBay and payed $139 for it but I talked to him and he said that he would do better for 5 - 10 units. His name is Paul and he trades on ebay under the name Sonicwavefactory and his number is 0419 217 067

Hope that is helpful

John

[kiwigeo]

Thanks for the link Jeff.....

[Kim]

Well I have quite a few guitars that I want pickups in.
I have one with K&K's pure western and installed another in a client's guitar the other day, really like the sound.
I tried to get K&K to give me luthier status so I could stock and do installs and promote them locally but they would not.
I really do not want to pay retail now.

So I got wondering, is there really any difference between these
http://cgi.ebay.com/25pc-20mm-piezos-w- ... 27b5822a1b
and the k&k's other than a bit of plastic moulding on the back and the convenient premade wiring.

Any thoughts?

A few years back, 4 or 5, I bought a set of ebay K&K 'copies' from an ebay dealer. His spiel was 'why should you pay $100+ from that well know manufacturer who make the same as I sell here on ebay for $50?'....the product looked the same, in fact prior to that I had even looked into a plastic dip product to make my own from peizo disk..even have a couple of piezo disk ready to experiment with that I had broken free out of cheap Dickie Smiths door alarms thinking their all the same...So I procrastinate for a while and then thinking that the plastic dip is going to cost me a bit to experiment with, I finally decide to spring the cash and send it to the guy on ebay for a set of his well reviewed K&K mini rip offs...You wan em Jeff?? You can have em, but I did destroy one getting it off the bloody bridge plate with acetone...it melted the plastic dip coating and the wrestling to get it off deformed the now un-supported disk.

Why did I take the $50usd set off you ask? Because they sounded like shit, heaps of bass, moderate mid and hardy any treble response. What's on the guitar now? A set of K&K pure and western minis. Am I happy? Well I am not her telling you that you can have them for free now am I. Could I have may be fitted the ebay set wrong and that caused the problem?? Possible but I don't think so cause the K&K's went right back were the others had been removed from cause despite clean up you could still clearly see where they had been because of the yellow CA stain on the spruce BP and that is where the K&Ks went.

My advice is stick with the K&K's cause I think there is more to peizo disk than a one type fits all approach and it is that knowledge that K&K charge for. If you must experiment, I recommend finding small disks about the size of the old 1c piece and work your way up from there, because the most commonly available look far too big, and whilst I am certain you will find that they do 'work', I am just as certain that you will find they will sound far too boomy.

Cheers

Kim

[fingerpickengood]

Try this http://cgi.ebay.com/K-K-Sound-Pure-Mini ... 20b4b53cc3

$US 86.10 plus 29 postage, I bought 2 and still only paid 29 postage, with the dollar at the moment it's a great deal. I love K&K's.

You need good cables with any pickup, I recently bought some lava cables, 10 foot around $65 from deluxe guitars Sth Melbourne, they really make a huge difference.

Michael

[kiwigeo]

Shipping is extra outside the US for that last supplier. The ebay merchant mentioned in Woodrat's post includes Express Shipping in the quoted price.....looks like a close but slightly better deal. Also less hastle if you need to return the goods.

I've just bought a few pickups from John's supplier and should have the goods in my hand tomorrow (Friday)...2 days after I ordered them. Will report on the deal once Ive got the goods.

Cheers Martin

[fingerpickengood]

The 2 pickups cost me $209 Aus, delivered within 2 weeks.

Michael

[kiwigeo]

Pickups arrived today via Express Post from Paul....all in good shape and well packed. Im happy with the price and the service.

[woodrat]

Martin, I just got mine in two days express post from Paul in Melbourne to Broome where I have been for a couple of weeks and fitted it to one of my guitars that a friend here has. Great service, he rang me on my mobile to confirm that he could get it out ASAP as I had a time constraint being away from home and it was a public holiday in Victoria ( Melb Cup) . I will deal with him again.

[JJ model]

I bought a stack ( about 100 pieces ) for less than a $ each! just need to solder both the inner and outer ring and cover it with some thick epoxy. it works!
http://www.guitarsolos.com/videos-piezo ... 2OE%5D.cfm

[rocket]

Piezo'' I have heard of these and seen pics but don't know much about them really. How do they work, where are they fitted in a guitar? . Can someone please enlighten me?
Cheers,,, Rod

[kiwigeo]

In most simplest terms certain materials (certain crystals and ceramics) develop a charge when mechanical strain is applied..this is the piezoelectric effect.

Piezo pickups come in different flavours. Some sit under the saddle (eg Fishman etc) while others such as the K and K Westerns are pad type and are glued on to the underside of the bridge plate.

[Puff]

As Martin said piezo material comes in different forms.
Everything herein hereafter is pretty much designed to invite Rick Turner into the discussion The coax version is typically used as an under saddle and the film can be under saddle or under bridge(or anywhere else you choose to try). My understanding is that the 'buttons' are film within a ring.
Whatever, they need squeeze pressure applied to them (the cables perimeter or the flat of the film) to create a charge which is read down the line as a tone.
From experience they only really screw up through poor or unequal/irregular contact with what they are 'reading' as a vibration or a bleep in the manufacture (very rare). Mount them on foam rubber and you've naffed them straight off.
For info on piezo material there's Experimental Musical Instruments site. Constructing pickups and pre-amp info on Liutaio Mottola's lutherie information site. Another simple one with wiring diagrams is on The Uncle Bob site.
One thing - and IMO it's a biggy - is matching things up and in this the Mottola site is helpful. Simply it all has to work together to get a good result and people have spent long hours working the equations. Hence the price of the complete package versus the cost of the bits.
As a nod - playing with R4 (in the Mottola schematic) through a three or five way switch is harmless/interesting fun

[rocket]

Does anyone think that a peizo would be suitable for installation in an archtop?
Cheers,,, Rod

[Nick]

Does anyone think that a peizo would be suitable for installation in an archtop?
Cheers,,, Rod

I believe there is an archtop bridge with a Piezo element integrated into it Rod (similar to an Under Saddle style) but I would have to do an internet search for it again as I can't remember where I saw it or the brand. Try a google search.

Just threw in "Piezo archtop pickup" & it kicked back these results, should get you started
http://www.schattendesign.com/archtop.htm
http://www.bestcovery.com/best-acoustic ... up-overall
http://www.fishman.com/products/details.asp?id=4
http://www.jemsite.com/compare-guitar-p ... zo-pickup/

[Puff]

Google "piezo for archtop guitar"
OK - Nick's already done it for you

[kiwigeo]

Does anyone think that a peizo would be suitable for installation in an archtop?
Cheers,,, Rod

K and K do 'em.

http://www.kksound.com/acousticguitar.html