Can you put Nitro over Danish Oil or Oil based mediums?

[needsmorecowbel]

Hey guys, sorry to hear about the hacking. I'll chuck up a how-to in a few weeks to share my somewhat 'novice' process with the forum...

Does anyone know if it is a horribly bad idea to put a Nitrocellulose finish atop a Danish oil? Or is it usually just safest to use a Nitrocellulose...

Someone in the forum asked a maker if he/she had used a rub on oil to achieve a two or three tone sunburst. How would this be achieved and what brands are usually good?

Stuart

[Allen]

Lacquer over oil.....No way.

[Kim]

How about if you sanded back well and then sealed with shellac Allen?

Cheers

Kim

[needsmorecowbel]

What would be a fairly easy way of doing a sunburst finish without the aid of a spray gun or Nitrocellulose then? Something that would have a similar and sturdy finish. Something say more durable than oil that would not require re-coats after setup and strings are on...

It is for a piece of Redgum/ Maple:

http://img222.imageshack.us/i/dscf3541s.jpg/

[Nick]

Danish Oil should be OK Allen as it is a spirit based oil. This is taken from Wikipeadia "Danish oil is a wood finishing oil, made of either Tung oil or Polymerized Linseed oil.
Danish oil is a hard drying oil which provides a tough, water-resistant finish. It can be used as a finish, or as a primer or sealer on bare wood before applying paint or varnish."
I read some years ago (can't remember where, I think it was one of StewMacs wonderful finishing books, I'll try and dig it out) that Paul Read Smith applied Danish oil to his natural flamed tops which gave them that 'special' PRS shimmer under finish. I've tried it myself with some success but was using Acrylic Laquer as a finish not Nitro so I couldn't say how that would behave. You must let it thoroughly dry before applying your top coats though. I will try and find the article again & post the instructions (providing I'm not breaching copyright ).

[P Bill]

As Kim says, seal it with shellac first and you should be OK. This is standard practice in the antique restoration game. Lacquer is very sensitive to "foreign body". If the surface isn't clean you'll get "reaction". This takes the form of tiny pin bubbles that are imposssible to sand away and recoat because they keep appearing.

In restoration the surfaces can have been dipped in caustic soda, oil finished, treated with chemical stripper and supposedly neutralized. No matter how well sanded, spraying lacquer first is a guaranteed reaction problem. No reaction at all with shellac and the lacquer will stick to the shellac with no reaction. This is true 99.9% of the time. Hope this helps. The motto in refinishing/restoration is : "shellac sticks to anything, and anything sticks to shellac".

[DarwinStrings]

My rule of thumb has been that nothing goes well over oil except maybe a oil based varnish (careful though as "varnish" is a broad term) but from what Nick has said my thumb may be wrong.

If you want a burst under oil you could use aniline dyes, check this tute. http://www.finewoodworking.com/SkillsAn ... x?id=30182

Jim

Life is good when you are amongst the wood

[matthew]

The motto in refinishing/restoration is : "shellac sticks to anything, and anything sticks to shellac".

Seems to be the case. I finished a kitchen table in danish oil recently, but it was VERY slow to dry (probably because i was in a hurry and saturated the wood and it was generally damp season) and unfortunately stank and stayed slightly sticky to touch, rendering it unusable in the kitchen for way longer than the few days I'd promised.

So I thought I'd run my FP muneca over the oil finish a few times. It worked! Sealed the oil finish, stopped the smell, tablecloths didn't stick any more and I was allowed back in the shed ... and over time the oil finish dried off

[needsmorecowbel]

Do you know a good brand of those dyes Jim or where to get them in Australia/Vic? I know the woodworking forum's sponsor is U Beaut but when i called them they said they were not specialty dies but food dies although a few people had got some for guitars.

Stu

[DarwinStrings]

You can buy aniline dye here Stu http://www.thewoodworks.com.au/shop/products, it goes along way so small amount like one or two scoops on the end of a paddle pop stick will do a guitar. I buy the 50gm ones and they will last me years. Be careful buying the black as they have two, one is spirit only the other is water, the rest of the colours are fine in water.

Jim

[Stephen Kinnaird]

Stu, I've never tried a sunburst with Danish oil. Interesting prospect, though.
Since you are using that figured wood, I assumed you were thinking of the oil to "pop" the grain...which it really will do.
However, as said above, you will need to seal the oil coat, and establish a barrier between that and the lacquer. I use a product called Qualasole, a padding finish made by Behlen. Works beautifully.

If you want to use aniline dyes for the burst, you can still pop the grain with a light wash of silver gray dye, applied and then mostly sanded off. Then finish as usual. The dye works more into the end grain of each curl, accentuating it when finish is applied. But whichever path you choose, you should test on scrap for sure.

That's a cool top, by the way.
Steve

[needsmorecowbel]

yeah it's a beautiful piece of red gum and that is why i would like to accentuate the natural colours in the wood rather than make it potentially cheap or plastic-esque.

[Nick]

You could always "experiment" with your off cuts Stuart? try a corner or an edge with want you want to try.