HNT Gordon Spokeshave

Talk about musical instrument construction, setup and repair.

Moderators: kiwigeo, Jeremy D

Post Reply
User avatar
Clancy
Blackwood
Posts: 620
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:26 am
Location: Canberra

HNT Gordon Spokeshave

Post by Clancy » Fri Sep 25, 2009 1:47 pm

Has anyone used a HNT Gordon Spokeshave to shape a neck?
Is it too wide to get near the heel/headstock?
To date I have used a mini planer attatchment for a dremel which removes wood quickly, makes plenty of dust and can be a bit of a wild ride.
I would like to try a proper spokeshave and am a fan of HNT G's planes.
Any other recomendations would be well recieved.
Cheers
Craig

User avatar
woodrat
Blackwood
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2008 6:31 am
Location: Hastings River, NSW.
Contact:

Post by woodrat » Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:02 pm

Hi Craig, I have the 1 inch Luthiers friend and use it in my cordless drill with a coarse grit sleeve to fair out the heel area as well as what Bil Cumpiano refers to as the "hyoid" area where the neck flairs to the wider peg head area. I hold the small plastic bearing with one hand and hold the cordless drill in the other. I think that panelbeaters use a similar more robust air powered tool with a handle on one end and the air powerhead on the other. You used to be able to buy the arbors separately from Stew Mac , I looked at their site and could only find the whole shebang for $184.00. Maybe if you email them, or maybe I just couldn't find it. Anyway I hope the suggestion is useful.

Cheers

John :)
"It's never too late to be what you might have been " - George Eliot

User avatar
Allen
Blackwood
Posts: 5252
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:39 pm
Location: Cairns, Australia
Contact:

Post by Allen » Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:48 pm

Not used the HNT spoke shave. Tried my old Stanley, but wasn't all that impressed with it. Especially on cranky grain.

Now I use the Dragon Rasps from Stew Mac. They work very well, and really easy to control.
Allen R. McFarlen
https://www.brguitars.com
Facebook
Cairns, Australia

User avatar
Dominic
Blackwood
Posts: 1098
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:58 am
Location: Canberra

Post by Dominic » Fri Sep 25, 2009 5:07 pm

Craig, I mostly use the dragon rasks like Allen. You may have seen mine. The corse one is the one I use most. Great for all parts of neck carving.
I have a radiused veritus spokeshave which speeds things up but its the rasp that does the best job from roughing to final shaping. And it cuts fast.
Dom
You can bomb the world to pieces,
but you can't bomb the world to peace!

User avatar
J.F. Custom
Blackwood
Posts: 779
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:13 pm
Location: Brisbane
Contact:

Post by J.F. Custom » Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:22 pm

Hi Craig,

I've seen the HNT in action and had a small play with one. It performs much like his planes - wonderfully. It is quite a bulky tool however so while a beautiful tool in itself, I'm not sure of its suitability for your intention.

I personally use a mix of tools depending on the instrument at hand.

I use Microplane rasps which are similar to the old surforms, but cut much faster and more smoothly. Not the cheapest, but there are a range of blades available and they are good quality items made in USA.

I have a handful of hand cut rasps too, made in Austria in various sizes. They are similar to the 'Dragon Rasps' mentioned above but are not the same manufacturer to the best of my knowledge. The hand cut rasps do an excellent job and its true they beat the machined units in cutting ability. These can rough out a neck pretty quickly.

Lastly on the spokeshave front, I love these tools. There is a vast difference between the cheap units and the pricey/quality ones though - much as with hand planes. So if you intend to purchase one, pay out for it and you won't be disappointed. They'll last a lifetime so are good value. I have and could recommend, amongst others, the Veritas Low Angle spokeshave. It is small, lightweight, comfortable and easy to use. It performs really well when set up correctly and the blade kept sharp. It also has the added bonus of being both a flat and rounded spokeshave in one. It is a little different from standard spokes though in that the blade is fixed while the toe/front of the unit adjusts to control your depth of cut. It is this that can be flipped around to provide the two different spokes, meaning you can cut convex, flat and concave shapes. Due to this design however, it does not have the micro-adjusting feature found on others, relying on you to set it up right.

I also have and use a range of other tools but these are the most relevant to your question and others replies.

My 2c for what it's worth.

Jeremy.

User avatar
Localele
Moderator
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:54 am
Location: Corndale,NSW
Contact:

Post by Localele » Sat Sep 26, 2009 5:51 am

Simple answer Craig is YES it is too big to get near the heel and the headstock , it is bulkier then the Record/Stanley type metal spokeshaves. Designed more for furniture curves than carving.I use the Microplane rasps which work quite well and follow up with a Bow Sander in 2 grits (80 & 120 ).Tool requirements vary depending on whether you shape the neck on or off the body.
Cheers from Micheal.

Remember the "5P Rule".
Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

User avatar
Clancy
Blackwood
Posts: 620
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:26 am
Location: Canberra

Post by Clancy » Sat Sep 26, 2009 6:10 am

Thanks guys.
Just for reference, this is the dremel planer attachment I'm currently using.
I cut the sides of the attachment right down to gain better access when I did the mandolin neck.
I then use this to first cut primary, then secondary, facets along the neck which are then smoothed.
This method enables me to maintain symmetry and straightness.
I just want to make shavngs now instead of dust.
(I'm on a war against dust - my new motto - 'No dust on me Mate')

Image

During the couple of weeks I recently spent in bed I virtually lived on the net researching anything that came to mind.
As far as spokeshaves go, I've tracked down every review on the net for Lie Nelson, Veritas Low Angle, Veritas Standard, HNT Gordon, Kunz, make your own woodens, small cheap brass, small expensive brass, stanley 151, stanley 53 and on and on (I had a lot of useless time to kill).
Even tried to buy a 53 on ebay (USA & UK included) but the collectors always pushed the price beyond anything reasonable. (Did get my hands on a cheap Record 043 Plough to do truss rod grooves - what alovely little plane and another job I don't need that dust dispensing router for!)
The HNT Gordon seems the best option for attacking a neck from any angle without risk of major damage.
But it's so bulky.
I'd like to get one cheap (unlikely) and modify it.
Maybe just get the blade and brass abutments & have a go at making my own....hmmm....another project.....
Got to go! got some sketching to do....and I'll need to find something for the brass sole insert...need a block of hardwood...hmmm

User avatar
Localele
Moderator
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:54 am
Location: Corndale,NSW
Contact:

Post by Localele » Sat Sep 26, 2009 6:35 am

Try out the microplane.They do take shavings and are prettyquick and controlable.I use a flat and large round usually.Get handles on both as it is quicker to change shapes.
http://www.carbatec.com.au/microplanes-round_c12500

Image
Cheers from Micheal.

Remember the "5P Rule".
Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

Matt_W
Gidgee
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:28 pm
Location: Melbourne

Post by Matt_W » Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:49 pm

Hi All

I have a Stanley 151 spokeshave. The edge/bevel needs bit bit more work. but it cuts nicely and doesn't dig in.

Has anyone used one of these or similar to carve guitar necks? My plan was to profile the neck at the heel and headstock and then cut the excess in between.

I have a coarse and fine rasp, which Ive used to shape a tote for a wooden plane. I wouldn't want to use it for getting rid of large amounts of wood tho, I used a jigsaw to shape the handle first. The rasps were quite quick to round off a basic shape tho. If I had a 3/8" round-off bit in a router I would have used that instead.

User avatar
Allen
Blackwood
Posts: 5252
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:39 pm
Location: Cairns, Australia
Contact:

Post by Allen » Wed Sep 30, 2009 7:22 pm

First off, welcome to the Forum "Slash"? What's your name so we can get to know you.

I've used that Stanely spoke shave, but I found mine to be rather unsatisfactory, due mostly to grain tear out on some particularly difficult wood. I got some rasps to use instead, and they work so well, that I haven't bothered with the spoke shave again. I'm afraid that the blade might have that North Queensland rust patina now that it's been neglected for so long.
Allen R. McFarlen
https://www.brguitars.com
Facebook
Cairns, Australia

User avatar
Arnt
Blackwood
Posts: 134
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 4:13 am
Location: Trondheim, Norway

Post by Arnt » Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:22 pm

New Stanley spokeshaves like the 151 can be greatly improved by upgrading the iron and some tuning. Out of the box, it is basically a kit and not a tool that is ready to use, in my opinion.

Here's what I did to mine:

* File away the globs of "Japanning" on iron's bed so it becomes a nice and flat exposed metal surface
* Grind the cap iron so it mates the iron perfectly
* File, grind and polish the hideous orange paint off the lower part of the cap so the shavings will pass a smooth surface.
* Toss the stock iron. It is poor quality steel, stamped and not very flat, and you will spend forever fiddling it, to no avail.
* Get a Hock iron. It takes and retains a great bevel, and unlike the stamped original, is perfectly FLAT. It is also a good bit thicker, so it tightens up the throat opening of the tool nicely.

With these improvements it actually performs just fine, and it makes nice shavings instead of constantly tearing out and clogging up. I use it mostly in my bow making, but it is also useful for guitar necks if the wood is not too figured and difficult. With the thumb wheels it is easy to skew the blade, so you can take fine shavings with one side and coarser on the other.

To shape necks I usually use, in that order, the band saw, stationary belt sander, a little chisel work before I move to an assortment of rasps, files and sand paper. Oh, and the spoke shave, sometimes.

I always prefer to make shavings instead of dust if I can, it helps to keep the wood dust allergy attacks at bay.
Arnt Rian,
Norway

User avatar
Kim
Admin
Posts: 4376
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 8:32 pm
Location: South of Perth WA

Post by Kim » Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:55 pm

Great advice on the Stanley Arnt, seems most of their stuff both old a new only comes to life after a good bit of fettling. I recent bought a HTN Gordon block plane, nice little figured mulga and HSS job and it works sweet as a nut right out the box. Terry Gordon's stuff is world class.

Welcome to the ANZLF Slash.

Cheers

Kim

User avatar
Allen
Blackwood
Posts: 5252
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:39 pm
Location: Cairns, Australia
Contact:

Post by Allen » Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:16 am

Thanks for the tips Arnt. I'll give them a go, after trying to find a good replacement blade.

And another thumbs up for HNT planes. I just got one of Terry's Trying Planes, and it's spot on right out of the box. Also makes shooting the edges to join tops and backs a no brainer. Just a few passes and they are dead straight. A real pleaser to use.
Allen R. McFarlen
https://www.brguitars.com
Facebook
Cairns, Australia

Matt_W
Gidgee
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:28 pm
Location: Melbourne

Post by Matt_W » Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:07 pm

Well firstly thanks for the welcome and comments.


Slashbot_427 is a sig that I use a lot, its from a lot of gaming forums I'm a member of, so I just sign in with that without thinking.

I'm pretty new to wood working,but have waded-in the deep end with a couple of guitar projects

The Stanley 151 I have is an older one( no idea how old really), it seems like it would be a good size for smaller work like a guitar neck.
Cheers


Matthew

Rick Turner
Blackwood
Posts: 311
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:22 am
Location: Santa Cruz, Ca.
Contact:

Post by Rick Turner » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:36 am

I pre-shape with a custom round over bit on an overarm pin router, then go to Nicholson #50 rasps...much like the Dragon. I make my pegheads separately from the shaft of the necks and then scarf them on after the basic machine work is done. This leaves only the hand stop area needing much hand carving. Works for me, and it's worked on several thousand instruments.
Rick Turner
Guitar Maker, Experimenter, Diviner
www.renaissanceguitars.com
www.d-tar.com

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google and 100 guests